EFTA00009586

Transcript April 24, 2007 f LA- Si' oQ n st i scat `v 1 &cmJvWS MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-O00368 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Pagc I of 35 EFTA00009586 1 1 UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT 2 SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF FLORIDA 3 4 5 6 7 RE: OPERATION LEAP YEAR 8 9 10 11 12 TESTIMONY, 13 I 14 15 16 17 18 Federal Grand Jury 07-103 Federal Building 19 U.S. Courthouse West Palm Beach, Florida 20 Tuesday, April 24, 2007 21 22 APPEARANCES: 23 24 25 roreperson OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LIC. (954) 467-8204. . MM20-OJ TESTIMONY-000389 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 2 of 35 EFTA00009587 2 • 1 The sworn testimony of was 2 taken before the Federal Grand Jury, West Palm 3 Beach Division, Federal Building, U.S. Courthouse, 4 Palm Beach County, State of Florida, on'Tuesday, 5 April 24, 2007. 6 Paula E. Angelocci, Certified Court 7 Reporter and Notary Public, State of Florida, 8 Official Reporting Service, LLC, 524 South Andrews 9 Avenue, Suite 302N, Fort Lauderdale, Florida, 10 33301, was authorized to and did report the sworn 11 testimony. 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000370 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 3 of35 EFTA00009588 3 1 (Witness enters the Grand Jury Room.) 2 THE FOREPERSON: You do solemnly swear 3 that the testimony you give will be the 4 truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the 5 truth, so help you God? 6 THE WITNESS: I do. 7 THE FOREPERSON: Thank you. Please be 8 seated. 9 EXAMINATION 10 BY III 11 Q Good afternoon, Ms. . Could you 12 state and spell your name for the record? 13 A 14 And where do you currently live? 15 A I live -- do you want me to give the 16 address? 17 Q Sure. 18 ,'West Palm Beach, 19 Florida 33412. 20 Q Okay. And you are living with your 21 parents now? 22 A Yes. 23 Q Were you served with a subpoena to 24 appear before the grand jury today? 25 A Yes. OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 167-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000371 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 4 of 35 EFTA00009589 4 1 Q And do you understand that an order was 2 signed by a judge compelling you to appear and 3 answer questions? 4 A Yes. 5 Q And that order states that what you tell 6 the grand jury won't be used against unless you 7 perjure yourself? 8 A Yes. 9 Q Do you understand that you are under 10 oath, and if you don't tell the truth -- 11 A I can go to jail, yes. 12 Q Okay. Let's start with where you went 13 to high school. 14 A 15 Q How old are you today? 16 A Twenty-one. 17 Q And what is your date of birth? 18 A 19 .Q What year did you graduate from 20 21 A 2004. 22 Q And where are you currently working? 23 A I currently am not working. 24 Q But you are 25 A OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM204J TESTIMONY-000372 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Pagc 5 of 35 EFTA00009590 5 1 Q Where will that be? 2 A Fort Lauderdale, Coral Springs. 3 Q What type of position will that be? 4 A 5 Q Have you worked since the time that you 6 graduated from high school? 7 A Uh-huh. Q Can you tell the grand jury what type of 9 jobs you have had? 10 A I worked at 11 worked in a club up in Orlando as as 12 well. I have also worked at a sports bar as a 13 waitress. 14 Q when you were in high school, where did 15 you work? 16 A and 17 ▪ And do you know Jeffrey Epstein? 18 A Yes, I do.. 19 Q Can you tell the grand jury how you 20 first came to meet Mr. Epstein? 21 A I met Epstein through two acquaintances, 22 and , and I met them at a beach resort. 23 They made a proposition to me. Later then I 24 picked them up and they gave me directions to the 25 house and that's where I was formerly introduced OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000373 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 6 of 35 EFTA00009591 6 1 to Mr. Epstein. 2 Q . Okay. And Let me just go back over that 3 a little bit. You mentioned that you had two 4' acquaintances, and , and you met them at 5 a beach resort, correct? 6 A Yes. 7 Q And you said that they made a 8 proposition to you. What was that exactly? 9 A had asked me if I wanted to make 10 money and she was working for this guy, Epstein, 11 in Palm Beach. So I told her I was interested and 12 she further went into detail about massaging him, 13 that you would have to take off articles of 14 clothing and there would be touching and fondling 15 involved. 16 Q How old were you when this happened? 17 A About 16. 18 Q And how old was 19 A Same age. 20 Q And how did you know MIF 21 A We went to together. 22 Q And she was in your same grade in high 23 school? 24 A Yeah. 25 Q And you mentioned that had OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000374 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 7 of 35 EFTA00009592 ( 1 previously worked for Epstein or was currently 2 working for Epstein? 3 A Yes, that's right. 4 Q So they explained this proposal to you 5 and you said that you would be interested? 6 A Yes. 7 Q What happened next? 8 A Within a couple of days to a week I 9 picked them up and I went to his house to work for 10 him and I was introduced to , who is his 11 assistant. She took me upstairs to Epstein's 12 bedroom and that's where the massage took place. 13 I was naked and he tried fondling me and 14 I wouldn't have it, so after the massage he gave 15 me another proposition to bring girls to the house 16 and for every girl that I brought I would make 17 $200. 18 Q All right. We'll go back over that a 19 little more slowly. I know this is a lot of 20 information. So let's go back to the proposition 21 that and made to you. 22 Did they say you would be paid for 23 massaging Mr. Epstein? 24 A Yes. 25 Q And how much would you be paid? OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000375 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Pagc 8 of 35 EFTA00009593 8 1 A $200. 2 Q Now you said that they had told you that 3 you might have to take your clothing off? 4 A They told me that I was expected to take S my clothing off and that there would be fondling. 6 Q Okay. And what -- did they explain 7 what fondling meant? a A Just that he'd be touching me. 9 Q Okay. And so you agreed to do that and 10 you went to Mr. Epstein's home? 11 A Correct. 12 Q And where was that located? 13 A Palm Beach, Brillo Way. 14 Q B -R -I -L -L -O? 15 A Yes. 16 Q And when you arrived at the home, you 17 said that you were driving with and IIII? 18 A That is correct. 19 Q Tell us how you got into the house. 20 A We went through a gate on the side of 21 the house that led to the back and we just rang 22 the doorbell and answered the door and we 23 were standing in the kitchen and then 24 brought me upstairs. 25 Q Okay. Now did you have any -- did OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 NIM20-GJ TESTIMONY-OOO376 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 9 of 35 EFTA00009594 1 tell you anything about what you would do when you 2 got upstairs? 3 A No, she never discussed that with me. 4 Q Did she say anything to you about taking 5 your clothes off? 6 A No, she never discussed that with me. 7 Q Okay. When you arrived upstairs, you 8 said that you went into a bedroom? 9 A That is correct. • 10 Q What was in the bedroom? 11 A It was a bedroom that had a door that 12 led to then I want to say a bigger more than just 13 a bathroom. It was a bigger room with like a 14 pretty large size walk-in closet, a shower, a 15 steam shower, and then two sinks. on the right, and 16 in the middle laid the massage table, and then to 17 the left there was two couches. 18 Q And so the massage table was already set 19 up when you arrived? 20 A That is correct. 21 Q Okay. And after led you up to the 22 bedroom, what did she do? 23 A She had left and that's when Epstein 24 came in. 25 Q Okay. And when Mr. Epstein came in, OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000377 CONFIDENTIAL 3501.182-031 Page 10 of35 EFTA00009595 10 1 what was he wearing? 2 A He was wearing a towel. 3 Q Okay. And nothing else? 4 A Nothing else. 5 Q And what did he do? 6 A He laid on the table and that's when the 7 massage began and later on he -- when he got in, I 8 took off my clothes and I was just wearing my 9 bottoms, and he later tried to touch me and he 10 grabbed my butt, and that's when. I had a problem. 11 I told him that I didn't feel comfortable. 12 So later he took the towel off and he 13 was laying on his back and he 14 asking me to 15 and then after that everything 16 was done. 17 Q Okay. So when Mr. Epstein 18 then the massage or whatever was over? 19 A Yes, it was. 20 Q And once that happened, what did he do? 21 A Just got up and dried himself off and 22 then walked me downstairs. 23 Q And you got dressed as well? 24 A That's right. 25 Q And when you got back downstairs, what OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000378 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 11 of 35 EFTA00009596 11 1 happened? 2 A I went back into the kitchen and he 3 pulled and aside and then we just left. 4 Of course, I got paid. 5 Q Okay. And tell us where you got paid, 6 who paid you, and how much you received? 7 A Epstein paid me. I received 200, but I 8 cannot recall if it was upstairs that he paid me or if he waited until I got back downstairs. 10 Q Okay. And when he paid you the $200, 11 was it in small bills, large bills? 12 A Big bills, 100s. 13 Q Okay. So two 100 dollar bills. And you 14 said that he pulled and aside. Do you 15 know what that was about? 16 A He would never pay them in front of me. 17 He always was funny about that. So I'm sure it 18 was just paying them for bringing me. 19 Q Okay. And you mentioned that you told 20 Mr. Epstein that you were uncomfortable with him 21 touching you? 22 A That's correct. 23 Q And what bec.ame of that? 24 A Later on before I left he had addressed 25 me to not massage him anymore, but asked me if I OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000379 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 12 of 35 EFTA00009597 12 y girl that I 1 could bring girls over, and for ever me $200. 2 brought to the table he would pay 3 • Q Okay. So you weren't comfortable with going to do any 4 him touching you, so you weren't 5 more massages? 6 A No. 7 Q He wanted you to find other girls? 8 A That's correct. let him 9 Q And he wanted girls that would 10 touch them? • 11 A Uh-huh. 12 Q After that first massage, did you house? 13 perform any other massages at his 14 A Absolutely not.. 15 Q Did you bring girls? 16 A That's correct. s 17 Q Tell us how you started to bring girl 18 to Mr. Epstein's house. ol, 19 Just girls that I met in high scho A said hi and bye 20 acquaintances, people that I just t it through 21 to. A lot of them actually heard abou they were 22 a couple of girls that I brought and 23 interested. t it. 24 Some of the girls asked me abou just get on the 25 Just girls in school I'd talk to, OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000380 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 13 of 35 EFTA00009598 13 1 subject. They had no problem with it. 2 Q Okay. So when you found a girl that you 3 thought would be interested, what exactly would 4 you tell her? 5 A I asked them if they were interest ed in 6 making extra money and that I knew an older 7 wealthier man in Palm Beach who liked to have 8 massages and they would get paid $200. 9 The more they did, the more they make, 10 and I would explain to them in detail what was 11 expected of them when they show ed up at the house 12 and I also told them that if they are under age 13 just lie about it and tell him that you are 18 14 Q Let's talk first about what you said 15 that you tell them what was expe cted of them. 16 A Yes. 17 Q First of all, why did you tell them 18 that? 19 A Because that's what I was told 20 O By whom? 21 A and 22 Q Okay. And did Jeffrey Epstein ever 23 address you about don't brin g girls over here if 24 they don't know what's going to happen? 25 A Absolutely. OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000381 CONFIDENTIAL 3501.182-031 Page 14 of35 EFTA00009599 14 1 Q Okay. So all the girls were supposed to 2 know that when they got there they would be 3 undressing? 4 A They would be undressing. There would 5 be. touching. There would be fondling. He was 6 very big on that. He told me never to bring a 7 girl over unless they knew what was expected. 8 Q Okay. And did you also tell them that 9 he would 10 A I didn't really talk to them about that. 11 I didn't know if he did it with everybody or it 12 was just with me that he did that. 13 Q But you told them that they all would 14 have to be partially naked or fully naked? 15 A Partially to fully naked and there would 16 be touching and fondling. 17 Q Okay. How many girls do you think you 18 took to Mr. Epstein's house? 19 A Seven, between seven to ten. 20 Q Okay. And were there any -- in addition 21 to this rule about the girls had to know what was 22 expected, did Mr. Epstein have any other rules in 23 terms of what the girls looked like or what he 24 liked? 25 A No. OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MNI20-GJ TESTIMONY-000382 CONFIDENTIAL 3501.1g2-031 Pagc 15 of 35 EFTA00009600 15 1 Q Okay. Were there girls that you brought 2 that he didn't like? 3 A There were a few girls he wasn't crazy 4 about. He didn't really like. He didn't favor. 5 for instance, 23, he thought she was kind 6 of too old. 7 Q Okay. So you brought a girl named 8 who was 23 years old? 9 A Yes. 10 Q And you were told that she was too old? 11 A Yes. 12 Q Did you ever bring her back? 13 A No. 14 Q What about any other girls that he 15 didn't like? 16 A This other girl T went to high school 17 with, III, she was maybe a year younger, and him 18 and her got . I told 19 her in detail what was expected and she, to me, 20 was all for it and then when she got there, 21 decided she didn't want to perform what was 22 necessary. So they got 23 and after that I never really brought her 24 25 Q Okay. And did either Jeffrey Epstein OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000383 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 16 of 35 EFTA00009601 16 1 or say anything to you about what happened 2 with III? 3 A He had made a comment just about 4 had asked -- he had asked me for someone to come 5 over and work and when I suggested III, he kind of 6 nodded, not really interested. He told me to find 7 somebody else. So I assumed that meant he really 8 didn't care for her. 9 Q Okay. Now the -- you mentioned 10 who was 23. What was the age range of the other 11 girls that you brought to Mr. Epstein's home? 12 A High school, 16 to 18. 13 Q Were there any girls who were younger 14 than that? 15 A Yes. 16 Q Who was that? 17 A 18 Q And how was she? 19 A' She was 14. 20 Q Okay. Now you were interviewed by the 21 Palm Beach Police Department? 22 A That's correct. 23 Q And during that interview, you told them 24 that there were two ways to make money with 25 Jeffrey Epstein. Can you explain to the grand OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000384 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 17 of 35 EFTA00009602 17 jury what those two ways are? 2 A The more you did is the more you make. 3 Basically, the more clothes that come off, the 4 more you let him touch you, the more you just let him have his way with you is the more that you 6 would make, otherwise, you would be demoted down 7 to bringing girls over and just making money that a way. 9 Q And that's what you were doing? 10 A That's correct. 1 1 Q Was bringing girls? 12 A That's correct. 13 Q If you could explain to the grand jury 14 how you would go about making an appointment for a 15 girl to come and give a massage? 16 A His assistant there would call me either 17 before they got into town or while he was in town 18 and either she would ask me for a particular girl, 19 preferably one that he favored, or if I couldn't 20 get a hold of that girl just bring somebody over 21 to work. 22 I would call the girl. She would okay 23 it. I would call back, confirm it, set an 24 appointment, and then the next couple of days we'd 25 go. OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000305 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 18 of 35 EFTA00009603 18 1 Q And was the person that you always 2 made the appointment with? 3 A Always. 4 • Do you remember ever talking to Jeffrey 5 Epstein on the telephone? 6 A Never. The only time I talked to him 7 was physically in person at his house. 8 • Okay. was really the person that 9 you had to•-- 10 A Deal with. 11 Q Okay. Now you mentioned that sometimes 12 would request a specific girl? 13 A That's correct. 14 Q Did she give you any reason why he 15 really liked this girl or just is this girl 16 available? What would happen on those calls? 17 A If it was a specific girl, she would 18 call me and just ask: Can this girl work? She 19 would never give me a reason. She would never go 20 into detail. It was just: Can she work, yes or 21 no? 22 Q And was saying to you can she 23 work? 24 A I can't recall if those were her exact 25 words. I can't remember if it•was: Can she come OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 • MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-OOO386 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Pagc 19 of 35 EFTA00009604 19 1 over and massage or can she work? / don't recall 2 the exact words. 3 Q Okay. And once you made those 4 appointments then who would normally take you and 5 the girls to the house? 6 A I would. 7 Q Okay. And you would drive? 8 A I would drive. 9 Q And were all -- wa's this always taking 10 place at Mr. Epstein's home? 11 A Yes. 12 Q On Brillo Way? 13 A That's correct. 14 Q When you spoke with on the 15 telephone, did you were all of these 16 conversations about setting up these appointments/ 17 A when I would talk to 18 Q Yes. 19 A Yes. It would be pure business whenever 20 I talked to 21 Q So you didn't have any sort of friendly 22 relationship? 23 A No friendly relationship, never 24 socialized unless I was at the house. It wasn't 25 like that at all. OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000387 3501.182.031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 20 of 35 EFTA00009605 20 1 Q Okay. Now when you would bring a new 2 girl over to the house, what would you do? 3 A Walk up the same way towards the back of 4 the house. They would let us in. I could sit in '5 the kitchen with the girl. I would either wait 6 for to come in or Jeffrey. Most of the time 7 it was 8 would bring the girl upstairs 9 while I waited downstairs. After the massage, the 10 girl would come downstairs. I would get paid and 11 then we would leave. 12 Q Tell us how you would get paid when you 13 were the person who brought the girls. 14 A What do you mean how I would get paid? 15 Q Who would pay you? 16 A Jeffrey Epstein would pull me aside 17 whether it be in his, I guess, living room slash 18 office. He would just make sure that when he paid 19 me, it was just me and him, nobody else was 20 around. 21 • And how much would you get paid for each 22 girl? 23 A $200- 24 Q And again with the two 100 dollar bills? 25 A Always 100 dollar bills. OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000388 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Pap 21 of 35 EFTA00009606 21 1 Q Did you ever see the girl who actually 2 did the massages get paid? 3 A No, I never saw them get paid. He never 4 paid us in front of each other 5 Q Okay. Did the girls ever tell you that 6 they did get paid or how much they got paid? 7 A Most of the time. 8 Q Okay. And how much money would each 9 girl get paid? 10 A It ranges. 11 Q From? 12 A It ranges from 200 to some got paid 300. 13 Like I said, the more you do, the more you make. 14 There were a couple of girls that got paid 300, 15 400, and then there were a couple of girls that 16 got paid 200 maybe even 100. 17 Q Now you mentioned that usually 18 would take the girl upstairs? 19 A That's correct. 20 Q Were there ever instances where you took 21 the girl upstairs? 22 A Very rarely. I think it happened once 23 or twice where was doing something or she 24 would need me to go upstairs and set up. I would 25 just go upstairs. I would show her where the OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000389 3501.182.031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 22 of 35 EFTA00009607 22 massage table was. 2 I would set it up for them. I would 3 show them where the towels were, put the towels on 4 the massage table and then I would tell them 5 Jeffrey would be in, in a minute and then I would 6 walk back downstairs and wait in the kitchen. 7 Q Okay. And when you were in these other instances where you led the girl upstairs, besides 9 the massage table, did you ever see any other 10 implements that were used during the massage? 11 A I think there were maybe a few occasions 12 where I would walk upstairs to show the girl or .13 maybe it was even when I first massaged him, there 14 was like a white on the table or a white 15 16 Q And can you describe that to the grand 17 jury? 18 A What it looked like? 19 Q What it looked like, yes. 20 A It was like a . It was really 21 The . It was white. I think 22 the top of it was maybe like pink. It was 23 that's all I remember. 24 Q Okay. And did any of the girls ever 25 tell you that that OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 NIM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000390 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 23 of 35 EFTA00009608 23 1 2 Q Okay. Now I'm going to run through the 3 names of some girls that you brought just to 4 confirm with the grand jury that you brought them. 5 A Okay. 6 7 A That's correct. 8 Q 9 A Correct. 10 11 A Correct. 12 Q 13 A Yes. 14 15 A Yes. 16 Q 17 A Yes. 18 Q And then there is another girl, 19 20 A never, ever, ever worked for 21 Jeffrey. She accompanied me to his house I think 22 once or twice and waited in the kitchen with me, 23 but she never worked for him. 24 Q Okay. But she was somebody that you 25 brought along with you? OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000391 3501.182.031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 24 of 35 EFTA00009609 24 1 A That is correct. 2 Q On visits? 3 A Yes. 4 Q Okay. In addition to those girls 5 that -- who I just named, you mentioned a woman, 6 , who is 23? 7 A Uh-huh. 8 Q Were there any other girls that you 9 recall bringing to Jeffrey Epstein's house? 10 A I cannot recall bringing anybody else. 11 Q Okay. Now one of those girls that we 12 mentioned .was correct? 13 A Yes. 14 Q And you told the police that Jeffrey 15 liked the best? 16 A Yes. 17 Q How old was 18 A She was around the same age as me, maybe 19 a grade lower than me. 20 Q Okay. So she was under age? 21 A Yes, correct. 22 Q And all of those girls who names I read 23 were under age when you brought them there? 24 A Except for 25 • Okay. What did look like? OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000392 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 25 of 35 EFTA00009610 25 1 A was . She kind of looks 2 but she's , maybe. She 3 had a . She had 4 5 Q Was she thin or heavy? 6 A No. She was maybe -- she had a 7 figure, maybe a little than me. 8 Q And how tall do you think she was? 9 A About 5'5, 5'6. 10 Q Okay. And you knew that Jeffrey liked 1 1 because he would specifically request her? 12 A There was a few occasions that he would 13 specifically ask for her, correct. 14 Q Okay. And you mentioned that some of 15 the girls told you about the 16 correct? 17 A Yes. 18 Q Did some of girls tell you what happened 19 inside of that bedroom? 20 A A few of them did. 21 Q Let's talk first about 22 A Okay. 23 Q Did she tell you what happened? 24 A All that she really told me was that 25 they got into . He had tried OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000393 CONFIDENTIAL 3501.182-031 Page 26 of 35 EFTA00009611 26 ) 1 fondling her. She wasn't having it, and then she 2 only got paid $100 and she felt like she was being 3 ripped off. 4 Q Okay. What about , did 5 she tell you about what happened? 6 A Yes. 7 Q What did she explain to you? 8 A , on the way home, had told me she 9 got paid $300, and basically let him 10 and 11 Q Okay. And she told you those things? 12 A She told me those things. 13 Q That he had and 14 had ? 15 A That's correct. 16 Q Okay. And that was -- when did she tell 17 you that? 18 A Right when we got outside into the 19 truck. 20 Q As you were driving away? 21 A That's correct. 22 Q Do you remember which other girls told 23 you about the 24 A I can't recall. I know there was 25 another one that said something about the OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000394 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 27 of 35 EFTA00009612 27 1 massager, but I wasn't really paying attention. 2 Q Now when you first went and gave Mr. 3 Epstein the massage, did he ask for your telephone 4 number after you were finished? 5 A No, did. 6 did. And she took down your 7 telephone number? 8 A She took down my name and my telephone 9 number. 10 • After that, how was all contact made 11 with you? 12 A 13 • Directly to you? 14 A Directly toward me. 15 Q Okay. So were there any more instances 16 where she went either through or to 17 reach you? 18 A Absolutely not. 19 Q Okay. Now when you brought girls over 20 was it the same thing where they would ask for the 21 girl's name and number? 22 A Yes. 23 Q And when that happened, would they 24 continue to go through you to set up appointments? 25 A Most of time they went through me. OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000395 35o .I s, _03 CONFIDENTIAL Fag,: 2N or 35 EFTA00009613 28 1 Actually 99.9 percent of the time they went 2 through me. On a few occasions, the girls that 3 they liked the best, for instance, , after 4 a while me and stopped contact with each 5 other and Jeffrey just went strictly through her. 6 Q Okay. And when an appointment was made 7 directly with the girl, you wouldn't necessarily 8 know about it? 9 A I would not necessarily know about it. 10 Q And when the appointment was made 11 directly with the girl then you wouldn't get paid, 12 correct? 13 A Correct. 14 Q Did you hear or do you know whether some 15 girls that you brought, brought more girls? 16 A Yeah, I'm sure of it. 17 Q Okay. When did you first meet 18 Was it that day that you went to give the 19 massage? 20 A That's correct. 21 Q And how did you first meet her? 22 A Just walking in the kitchen and waiting 23 for somebody whether it be Epstein or 24 came and introduced herself as and I 25 learned that she was Epstein's assistant. OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000398 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 29 of 35 EFTA00009614 29 1 Q And you said that she was the one who 2 took you upstairs on the first day? 3 A That's correct. 4 Q And we were talking earlier about how 5 appointments would be made for you to bring 6 additional girls, correct? 7 A Yes. 8 Q How far in advance would call you 9 to make appointments? 10 A It depends. Sometimes she would call me 11 a few days in advance. Jeffrey is going to be in 12 town tomorrow or this weekend, have a couple of 13 girls lined up or have a girl lined up. So it 14 would be anywhere between a couple of days to a 15 weekend. 16 Q Okay. Did you ever talk with or 17 did ever tell you anything about what 18 Jeffrey liked to do with the girls? 19 A Absolutely not. We never discussed 20 that. 21 Q Did you ever talk with her about a rumor 22 that you had heard that a girl had intercourse 23 with Jeffrey? 24 A One day I was talking on the phone with 25 and I addressed her with it, asking her OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000397 CONFIDENTIAL 3501.182-031 Page 30 of 35 EFTA00009615 30 1 about a rumor I heard of a girl sleeping with 2 Jeffrey, having intercourse, and making $1 ,000, 3 and she denied it and said that he doesn't do that 4 kind of thing, he just plays with them. 5 Q Okay. So she said that he didn't have 6 intercourse, he just liked to play with the girls? 7 A That's correct. 8 Q And when you spoke with the police, you 9 said that Jeffrey liked to 10 11 A That's correct. 12 Q What led you to believe that? 13 A He just did it. I just learned that 14 Epstein just 15 . It was like the new thing for him, and 16 it just started happening and more and more girls 17 were making comments. 18 Q So did know that he was 19 20 A Not that I know of. I didn't say 21 anything and I don't think she had an idea. I 22 think she knew there was playing going on. I 23 don't think she knew of what sort. 24 Q . Okay. So she knew that something sexual 25 was going on., but not necessarily what that OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000398 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 31 of 35 EFTA00009616 31 1 entailed? 2 A Correct. 3 Q Okay. Did Jeffrey or or anyone 4 else who worked for Mr. Epstein ever ask you for 5 proof of someone's age? 6 A Never. 7 Q Did they ever specifically instruct you 8 that you shouldn't bring girls who were under age 9 to the house? 10 A Never. 1 1 Q And when you spoke with the police 12 department you said that at some point Jeffrey 13 said the younger the better? 14 A That's correct. 15 Q And even after that he never said to you 16 but make sure that they are over 18? 17 A We never discussed age. He never made a 18 comment about age except for that one time 19 about her being too old. He never told me to go 20 find under aged girls, but at the same time never 21 said make sure they are over 18. It was never 22 discussed. 23 Q Okay. All right. 24 I'm going to ask you to 25 step outside for a minute and I will find out OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000399 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 32 of 35 EFTA00009617 32 1 if the grand jury has questions. Thank you 2 very much. 3 (Witness exits the Grand Jury Room.) 4 * * 5 (Witness enters the Grand Jury Room.) 6 BY 7 Q Hs. I have to remind you that 8 you are still under oath. There were just two 9 follow-up questions. The first one is something 1'0 that I think you spoke about earlier, but who 11 first asked you to find other girls? 12 A Who first asked me to first other girls? 13 Q Yes. 14 A That would be Epstein. 15 Q Okay. So Jeffrey asked you himself, 16 Jeffrey Epstein himself asked you? 17 A Yes. 18 Q Okay. And then the other question was: 19 Are you currently in contact with anyone who works 20 for Mr. Epstein or himself? 21 A I don't talk to any of the females that 22 I once brought over there. I haven't been in 23 contact with Epstein for years. He tried 24 contacting me a few times. 25 I haven't contacted him back. I refuse OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000400 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 33 of 35 EFTA00009618 ,33 1 to talk to him. I refuse to talk to any of the 2 girls that were involved. However, I did live 3 with one of the girls in Orlando for a couple 4 months to a year. I haven't spoken to her in over 5 a year either. 6 Q Okay. So after and just so the grand 7 jury has a sense here, we are talking about the 8 2004 to 2005 period is when you were bringing 9 girls over? 10 A That's correct. 11 Q So since then 12 A I don't -- to be honest with you, I 13 think it was more 2003, 2004. 14 Q Okay. 15 A My junior senior year. 1,6 Q Okay. But anyhow it .was a couple of 17 years ago? 18 A Several years ago. 19 Q Okay. 20 Is there any follow up 21 on either of those points? Yes, 22 A GRAND JUROR: Was it Jeffrey Epstein 23 himself trying to contact you or 24 THE WITNESS: I don't know if it wasliim 25 directly. I know that his number showed up OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000401 CONFIDENTIAL 3501.182-031 Page 34 of 35 EFTA00009619 34 1 on my house phone. I'm assuming because 2 gill. was there, I'm assuming that she is the 3 one that has been trying to contact me in the 4 past years. Epstein never talked directly to 5 me on the phone. 6 : Any other follow up? 7 Okay. Thank you, IIIIII Thank you for 8 coming. 9 (Witness was excused.) 10 1 1 12 13 14 CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER 15 16 I, Paula E. Angelocci, Certified Court 17 Reporter and Notary Public, do certify that the 18 transcript is a true and correct transcription of 19 my stenotype notes of the testimony of 20 taken before the Federal Grand Jury, 21 West Palm Beach, Florida. 22 AULA E. AA NGHIQICCI, CSR #4869 23 Certified Court Reporter 24 25 OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE, LLC (954) 467-8204 MM20-GJ TESTIMONY-000402 3501.182-031 CONFIDENTIAL Page 35 of 35 EFTA00009620 ( ( EFTA00009621