EFTA01073675

Page 1 IN THE CIRCUIT COURT OF THE 15TH JUDICIAL CIRCUIT IN AND FOR PALM BEACH COUNTY, FLORIDA Complex Litigation, Fla. R. Civ. Pro.1201 CASE NO. 50 2009CA040800XXXXMB AG JEFFREY EPSTEIN, Plaintiff, ORIGINAL vs. SCOTT ROTHSTEIN, individually, BRADLEY J. EDWARDS, individually, and ., individually, Defendants. DEPOSITION OF DEAN RUSSELL KRETSCHMAR Taken on Behalf of the Plaintiff DATE TAKEN: Friday, February 11, 2011 TIME: 9:10 AM - 11:40 AM PLACE: Fowler White Burnett, P.A. One Financial Plaza - 21st Floor 100 Southeast 3rd Avenue Fort Lauderdale, FL 33394 Examination of the witness taken before: Lee Lynott, Certified Merit Reporter Registered Professional Reporter Certified Shorthand Reporter, Florida Hi-Tech/United Reporting, Inc. 1218 SE 3rd Avenue Fort Lauderdale, FL 33316 United Reporting. Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073675 Page 2 APPEARANCE FOR THE PLAINTIFF: FOWLER WHITE BURNETT, P.A. BY: SUSAN APRIL, ESQUIRE LILLY SANCHEZ, ESQUIRE One Financial Plaza - 21st Floor 100 Southeast 3rd Avenue Fort Lauderdale, Florida 33394 APPEARANCE FOR THE DEFENDANT BRADLEY EDWARDS: SEARCY DENNEY SCAROLA BARNHART & SHIPLEY BY: WILLIAM KING, ESQUIRE 2139 Palm Beach Lakes Boulevard West Palm Beach, Florida 33409 11 12 APPEARANCE FOR THE WITNESS DEAN KRETSCHMAR: 13 CONRAD & SCHERER BY: MAXINE K. STREETER, ESQUIRE 14 633 South Federal Highway Fort Lauderdale, Florida 33301 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073676 Page 3 1 2 INDEX 3 4 Deposition of Dean Kretschmar: Page No. 5 Direct Examination by Mrs. April 4 6 Certificate of Oath 77 7 Certificate of Reporter 78 8 Read and Sign Letter to Witness 79 9 Errata Sheet (to be forwarded upon execution) 80 * * * 10 11 12 PLAINTIFF'S EXHIBIT INDEX 13 No. Description Page No. 14 ***** NONE ***** 15 16 DEFENDANT'S EXHIBIT INDEX 17 No. Description Page No. 18 ***** NONE ***** 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073677 Page 4 1 THEREUPON, 2 * * * 3 DEAN RUSSELL KRETSCHMAR 4 A witness of lawful age, having been called, was first duly 5 sworn by the undersigned Notary Public. 6 THE WITNESS: Yes. 7 DIRECT EXAMINATION 8 BY MRS. APRIL: 9 Q. Sir, would you say your full name. 10 A. Dean Russell Kretschmar. Last name is 11 K-r-e-t-s-c-h-m-a-r. 12 Q. Where do you live? 13 A. I live here in Fort Lauderdale. 14 Q. And what's your address; business or home, either? 15 MRS. STREETER: Can we do this off the record? 16 MRS. APRIL: Sure. 17 MRS. STREETER: Go ahead. 18 (WHEREUPON, the answer was provided 19 off-the-record). 20 BY MRS. APRIL: 21 Q. Did you receive a subpoena to be here today, do you 22 know if you did? 23 A. Yes, I did. 24 Q. And are you represented by counsel today? 25 A. Yes. United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073678 Page 5 1 Q. And is that Mrs. Streeter? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Mr. Kretschmar, I heard you say before you were 4 sworn in and we went on the record that you hadn't been 5 deposed before. I'm Susan April, we met out in the hallway. 6 I represent a plaintiff in a lawsuit and that plaintiff is 7 named Jeffrey Epstein. And Lilly Sanchez, who is with me 8 today, is also from Fowler, White, Burnett, who represents Mr. Epstein. And you met Mr. King. 10 You will be asked questions by plaintiff's lawyer 11 and if the defendant's lawyer wants to ask questions, that's 12 certainly his prerogative. We ask you to let us know if you 13 need something restated or repeated; the court reporter can 14 read things back. If you need to stop just say you need to 15 stop, you'd like to take a break. 16 As I think you got some tea, if you want anything 17 else or you want to pause to get something, let us know. 18 Okay? 19 A. Do I just say, Can we pause? 20 Q. Yes. You can say, Can we stop. 21 A. Do I raise my hand like we're in school. 22 Q. The only thing I would ask is that if you're in the 23 middle of an answer to a question or if there is a question 24 pending before you break to go to the restroom or anything 25 that you finish that answer so that we're not broke in United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073679 Page 6 1 sequence. 2 A. Understood. 3 Q. One other thing that witnesses sometime forget, 4 lawyers too, is that because everything you say is being 5 typed and the court reporter can only type one person at a 6 time, let the lawyer who is asking you a question finish 7 their complete question if you're able to determine the 8 question is over before you answer, because there is a 9 tendency with some people, they think they know the answer so 10 they say it before the question is completed and that makes 11 the typed record confusing. Okay? 12 If you need anything else, let us know. Okay? 13 A. Okay. 14 Q. Did you know that there was a lawsuit pending that 15 Jeffrey Epstein had filed against Scott Rothstein and Bradley 16 Edwards and someone named prior to being subpoenaed in 17 this case? 18 A. No. 19 Q. Are you currently a party in any lawsuit against 20 Scott Rothstein and others? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. I understand you're represented by counsel and I 23 assume that you've been advised that you do not have to 24 disclose anything that was said between you and your lawyers. 25 So if I ask you a question, I'm not asking you to breach that United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073680 Page 7 1 confidence. So I'm trying to ask questions that don't go 2 there, all right? If you have any difficulty with it or you 3 want it restated, please let me know. 4 What's the nature of the lawsuit that you're 5 currently in? 6 A. The nature of the lawsuit is: We were defrauded on 7 investments into Scott Rothstein's law firms for confidential 8 settlements. 9 Q. When you say we were defrauded, who do you mean, as 10 best you can describe it? 11 A. Myself, my family, and there were others. 12 Q. And again, in your own words, how were you 13 defrauded? 14 A. We were sold on the fact that the confidential 15 settlements were real cases, they weren't typical court 16 cases. Many of these settlements were confidential in the 17 nature that they were being handled by two attorneys, you 18 know, outside of having to go to court. 19 And based on various reasons and the plaintiffs 20 wanted a settlement for whatever they were wronged on, and 21 those settlements were timed out over time and, basically, we 22 were funding the plaintiff getting their money then versus 23 waiting for that timed period to end. 24 Q. How did you hear about this investment in the first 25 place? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073681 Page 8 1 A. Barry Bekkedam. 2 Q. And it's Bekkedam? 3 A. Yeah, Barry Bekkedam. I could give it a crack to 4 start off. 5 Q. Don't worry about spelling anyone's name. I'm 6 happy with phonetics and after we're done, you can clarify. 7 A. His firm is Ballamor Capital Management. 8 Q. And how do you know Barry Bekkedam? 9 A. He is dating, used to be a friend of mine, Diane 10 Barnett. 11 Q. So are you saying you met him sort of through 12 social circles? 13 A. Yeah. 14 Q. When you say Diane Barnett used to be a friend, is 15 she no longer a friend of yours? 16 A. No. 17 Q. Did you have a falling-out? 18 A. Yeah, you could say this whole situation has put a 19 bit of a strain on 20 Q. Does Diane Barnett live in Florida? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. In Fort Lauderdale? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. Is she also in the, is she a financial advisor or 25 investment counselor? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073682 Page 9 1 A. No, she has a real estate license. She worked for 2 the Galleria of Fine Homes I think. 3 Q. So you met Barry through Diane? 4 A. Uh-huh (affirmative response). 5 Q. And where did you meet him? 6 A. We met out socially. Diane invited me out to have 7 a drink. She wanted me to meet the gentleman that she was involved with. 9 Q• And is that where you got to talking about the 10 business he was in? 11 A. He wasn't, well, his business in the sense of as a 12 money manager, but it wasn't the first meeting that I learned 13 about this. It was several meetings after and he also 14 pitched my stepfather. 15 Q. When you met Barry was it here in Florida? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. And do you know what year that was? 18 A. End of '09. Third, probably Fourth Quarter 19 of '09. 20 Q. Again, I understand you probably won't remember 21 every detail so my questions are directed to as best you can 22 recall. 23 A. Sure. 24 Q. What do you recall Barry telling you about the 25 investment when you first -- when he first spoke to you about United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073683 Page 10 1 it, the investment that led to you being in a lawsuit against 2 Scott Rothstein and others? 3 A. He told me his firm had done a lot of the due 4 diligence, was still in the process of finishing due 5 diligence, but he was working closely with George Levin and 6 George Levin's team in doing the background due diligence and 7 that George Levin personally had 600 million into this 8 investment. And that over the past five years there hasn't 9 been any issues, no late payments, everything has been on 10 time. 11 He disclosed that George had one discrepancy on his 12 background, which was a kit car company that George owned, 13 and there was something of some of the customers felt 14 defrauded and the cars came out late or something and there 15 was a court case about it. It all ended up being settled, 16 but that was something of, you know, you could find out 17 through your own research that something negative happened. 18 And I've been in business enough that sometimes things 19 happen; customers are, you know, upset and it can be, you 20 know, twisted. 21 So, through Barry explaining - through his due 22 diligence and that his teams had done all of this extensive 23 research and looked at some of the books with Levin's company 24 with the investment, also, meeting with Scott Rothstein and 25 understanding how the investments are confidential in nature, United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073684 Page 11 1 that there was a third -party verifier, who was Mike 2 Szafranski, that a hedge fund out of New York had requested 3 when they made their investments years before he was put in 4 charge of being an outside verifier that the funds were in 5 there - that it gave me, you know, some confidence about the 6 investment. 7 Q. Let me back you up a little bit. Do you remember 8 when Barry first told you about this investment before he 9 started talking about due diligence, how did it come up? 10 mean, were you having dinner? Were you at someone's house? 11 Where were you? 12 A. I don't remember. 13 Q. Did he just out of nowhere say, I have an 14 investment I want to talk to you about? 15 A. No. I mean, if somebody is a money manager, you 16 know, an investment advisor as he is in a sense of a 17 balanced-portfolio -type advisor - meaning that he would put 18 your monies in several different low risks to, you know, if 19 you want to do some things that are a little bit more of what 20 would be termed a high risk - I was curious of things that he 21 saw in the market. And he was doing middle market financing 22 as the leverage in banks and so forth were not lending. You 23 know, there's a lot of businesses that just needed cash flow 24 and they couldn't get it from the bank. 25 So, it was through conversations that he didn't United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073685 Page 12 1 just bring this one up, he had others that he was, you know, 2 explaining to me. So we, you know, in a sense it was normal 3 that we talked some shop. 4 Q. When he told you about the investment, what did he 5 call the investment? I mean, we've been calling it the 6 investment. Did he say it's the Rothstein investment? 7 A. Banyon Income Fund. 8 Q. Banyon Income Fund. Is that the fund that George 9 Levin was running? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. And when he first mentioned it to you, when Barry 12 first mentioned it to you, who else was present? 13 A. Diane Barnett. 14 Q. Anyone else? 15 A. No. 16 Q. So after Barry described this Banyon Income Fund to 17 you, what was the next thing you did, if anything, to invest 18 in it? 19 A. He was pitching my father and I didn't do anything. 20 I was in New York at the time working with a hedge fund, so 21 it wasn't until a little bit later that when my stepfather 22 and I talked and he had, you know, heard about it that I gave 23 it more interest. 24 Q. So you just said your father and your stepfather, 25 is that the same person? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073686 Page 13 1 A. Yeah, same person. Sorry. 2 Q. What's his name? 3 A. Doug Von Allmen. 4 Q. Do you know how Barry came to know your stepfather? 5 A. Through Diane. Diane introduced Barry to all of 6 Fort Lauderdale. 7 Q. I see. When you say you were in New York working 8 at a hedge fund, was this like your job at the time or were 9 you up there exploring investments? 10 A. It was a job. I was looking to raise capital for a 11 hedge fund, so I was learning from them about their 12 strategies and what they were all about to be able to speak 13 intelligently to people, but the market had crashed. 14 Everybody's strategies were changing every day it seemed. 15 And it was around April of 2010 I said, you know what, 16 it's -- I'm not jumping into the market of investing -- 17 MRS. STREETER: April 2010? 18 MRS. APRIL: Let's get that timing right. 19 THE WITNESS: When did I make my investment? 20 BY MRS. APRIL: 21 Q• Let me see if this will -- I've got something with 22 a date on it. 23 Sir, the lawsuit that I referred to that I asked if 24 you were a party in -- 25 A. Uh-huh (affirmative response). United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073687 Page 14 1 Q. -- do you know if that was filed in November of 2 2009? I do have a copy of some pages. Do you happen to 3 know? 4 A. Off the top of my head per date, no. 5 Q. Well, I'm going to show you what is -- This doesn't 6 show you the file date. 7 MRS. SANCHEZ: That's the amended one. 8 BY MRS. APRIL: 9 Q. It is a 2210-page document, so I don't have it all 10 in front of me. So, let me just show you this and see if it 11 refreshes your memory. 12 Have you ever been a party in a lawsuit before? 13 A. No. 14 Q. I'm going to show you what we call the caption, 15 just the first page that has all the names of the parties of 16 this suit and it goes on to a second page, to see if that -- 17 And you can see it has a date stamp. And also, you'll see on 18 Page 2 it shows you it's not the original. 19 A. Uh-huh (affirmative response). 20 Q. The number of this case is 09-062943 (19). And I 21 don't know if there is any dispute and we have to torture the 22 witness here by asking him to figure it out. 23 MRS. APRIL: Can we all agree that it was filed in 24 2009? 25 MRS. STREETER: Yes. The record will speak for United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073688 Page 15 1 itself. 2 BY MRS. APRIL: 3 Q. Mr. Rretschmar, you said something earlier and I 4 think you may be off in time and I think your lawyer 5 recognized it. Do you remember if your knowledge of the 6 fraud you mentioned is essentially the same time that it 7 became publicly known that Scott Rothstein's firm had had a 8 crisis and was falling apart? 9 Do you remember hearing about that just from others 10 or in the news that the Rothstein, Rosenfeld & Adler firm was 11 in trouble? 12 A. Right. 13 MR. KING: Objection to form, it's compound. 14 BY MRS. APRIL: 15 Q. Do you remember when you heard something about the 16 firm? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. Do you know about when that was? What time of 19 year? A season or a holiday or something like that? 20 A. Yeah, it was the end of October, like the 31st, 21 going into November. 22 Q. Of what year? 23 A. Had to be 2009. 24 Q. And do you know if you became a party in the 25 lawsuit that I just showed you the caption of? Let's call it United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073689 Page 16 1 for short, the first name is Razorback Funding, LLC. I was 2 going to call it the Razorback suit, if that's okay, versus 3 Scott Rothstein and a number of others? 4 A. Uh-huh (affirmative response). 5 Q. Do you know if you became a party in this suit soon 6 after you learned that the Rothstein firm had a problem? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. So I want to go back and ask you if the dates are 9 correct in your previous answer. 10 When you first met Barry -- What did you say his 11 name was, Bekk I'm going to call him -- 12 MRS. STREETER: Bekkedam, B-e-k-k-e-d-a-m. 13 BY MRS. APRIL: 14 Q. When you first met Barry was it the year before 15 that or was it just a month -- 16 A. It would be the end of '08. 17 Q. Thank you. 18 A. And when I left the hedge fund it would have beer., 19 you know, March or April of '09. 20 MRS. STREETER: Just answer her questions. 21 BY MRS. APRIL: 22 Q. And the hedge fund that you left was called what? 23 A. WR Capital Management. 24 Q. So do you know when you or your stepfather first 25 put any money into Banyon Capital, roughly? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073690 Page 17 1 A. May of 2009. 2 Q. And this is after you left WR Capital Management. 3 At that time were you employed? 4 A. I don't understand. 5 Q. In the Spring of 2009 were you working someplace? 6 A. No. 7 Q. You were just doing your own investments? 8 A. Yeah. 9 Q. So let me go back to that. The year is -- After 10 your initial investment in Banyon Capital was it your 3.] personal investment or was it made through some entity? 12 A. I'm sorry. Could you repeat the question? 13 Q. When you first invested in Banyon -- 14 MRS. STREETER: Income Fund. 15 MRS. APRIL: Thank you. 16 Q. -- (continuing) Income Fund, was it a personal 17 investment of Dean Kretschmar or did you invest through some 18 entity that you formed? Do you know what I mean? 19 A. Yes, I understand what you're asking. It's either 20 one or the other. 21 Q. If you're not sure, you can tell me that. 22 A. I'm not sure. It could have been my Living Trust 23 or me, personally. 24 Q. After April or May of 2009 did you make any further 2.5 investment into any opportunity offered by Scott Rothstein or United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073691 Page 18 1 his firm? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Can you tell me what that was? 4 A. That was in Razorback. 5 Q. And when was that, if you know? 6 A. That was in July. 7 Q. And -- 8 MRS. STREETER: Counsel, are you asking when he 9 made the investment or when he first heard about it? 10 MRS. APRIL: Well, I'm going to ask him the second 11 question, but I had asked him when he made the 12 investment, actually, put money into it. 13 MRS. STREETER: If you're not sure of the dates 14 A. I know when I made my first investment, it was 15 June. It was early June, 1st or 2nd. 16 Q. I'm not trying to trip you up with these dates. 17 I'm just trying to get a time frame generally. 18 So, let me ask you this: When did you -- what is 19 Razorback? 20 A. What is Razorback? 21 Q. Yeah. Other than it's a plaintiff on the lawsuit 22 that we talked about, I mean, is it a company? 23 THE WITNESS: Can I speak to you outside? 24 MRS. STREETER: Yes. 25 (WHEREUPON, an off-the-record discussion was had). United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073692 Page 19 1 MRS. STREETER: I just want to put on the record 2 that Mr. Kretschmar is here to answer questions about 3 what happened with regard to the Epstein litigation and 4 the other litigation. The Razorback litigation is an 5 ongoing, pending litigation and we ask that you 6 refrain from getting into any of those specific details 7 regarding investments that are not relevant and are not 8 reasonably calculated to lead to any evidence in your 9 case in particular. If you could get to this particular 10 issue. 11 MRS. APRIL: I'll try. 12 (WHEREUPON, an off-the-record discussion was had). 13 MRS. APRIL: I have in case anybody wants to refer 14 to them, including me, some calendars. Sometimes it 15 makes it a little easier to know when things happened. 16 BY MRS. APRIL: 17 Q. So you invested in something called Razorback? 18 A. Uh-huh (affirmative response). 19 Q. We established that, right. And was Razorback's 20 investment also into the settlements or the kind of 21 settlements you described a little bit earlier with 22 Rothstein? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. Did you invest after the investment in Razorback 25 any other times with Scott Rothstein in one of these United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073693 Page 20 1 settlement funds? 2 MR. KING: Objection. Form. Vague. 3 BY MRS. APRIL: 4 Q. Did you ever make any other investment offered by 5 Scott Rothstein after the Razorback? 6 A. No. 7 Q. Did you ever meet Scott Rothstein? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. Do you know when you first met him? 10 A. At a Boys and Girls Club fundraiser. It was the 11 Boca Resort. It's the car fundraiser where they have all the 12 cars. I forget what it's called. 13 Q. Do you know what year it was approximately? 14 Probably 2008. 15 Q. Did you have any substantive conversation with him 16 at that time -- 17 A. Nothing. 18 Q. -- about business or anything? 19 A. No. 20 Q. Was there ever a time where you met with Mr. 21 Rothstein and talked about business? 22 A. No. 23 Q. Was there ever a time after the Boca event for the 24 Boys and Girls Club that you met Scott Rothstein? 25 A. Not before the investment. United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073694 Page 21 1 Q. Okay. Let's talk about then the time of the 2 investment. Did you have any face-to-face meetings with 3 Scott Rothstein in 2009? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. Can you describe as best as you can recall the 6 first -- Was there more than one of those? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. Can you describe to the best of your ability your 9 first face-to-face business meeting with Rothstein about the 10 investment? 11 A. I was there. My father was there. Barry Bekkedam 12 was there. Barry Bekkedam and Ballamor Capital, some of his 13 people were there. George Levin was there. Frank Preve was 14 there. A.J. DiScala was there. 15 Q. Where is there? 16 A. And Scott Rothstein's personal office in his 17 firm. 18 Q. Had you ever been in his firm's offices before? 19 A. No. 20 Q. Was that over here on Las Olas, an office building? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. And were there any other persons present that you 23 can remember? 24 A. (No response). 25 Q. Let me rephrase that. Even if you can't remember United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073695 Page 22 1 their names, do you think there were other persons in the 2 room? 3 A. Yeah. 4 Q. Can you describe the office to me? In other words, 5 was it a conference roam like we're in today or something 6 different? 7 A. It was a combination office and conference room. 8 It had a large sectional couch, a lot of pictures of Scott 9 with various celebrities, to governors, to presidents. It 10 was elaborate, very nicely built-out office. 11 Was there also a conference table or -- 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. And was it about as big as the one we're at today 14 which looks like it holds about 12 chairs? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Was it pretty much filled? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. What month was that, if you know? 19 A. I don't recall. 20 Q. Let me go back to that later and build to that. 21 How did you happen to be there that day, were you invited by 22 Mr. Rothstein? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. And was this morning, lunch time, afternoon, did 25 you have a meal or anything? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073696 Page 23 1 A. I don't, I don't recall. 2 Q. Was this meeting in the Fall of 2009? Was it 3 football season? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. Did some of the individuals who were there, like 6 Barry, travel from out of state to come to the meeting? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. Did you spend any time with Barry prior to this 9 meeting, social or business? 10 A. I don't remember. 11 Q. You said Barry and Ballamor Capital, that's his 12 firm, right? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. Do you remember if he was accompanied by some other 15 individuals from his group? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. Do you know their names, any? 18 A. Larry Rovin. 19 Q. Is that Rovin? 20 A. Rovin, R-o-v-i-n. I think he's an attorney 21 there. 22 Q. Anybody else? 23 A. Yes, but I don't remember the names. 24 Q. And you don't remember if you, like, went out with 25 that group to dinner or a ball game or on a boat or anything United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073697 Page 24 1 during that visit? 2 A. No, we didn't. We didn't do that. 3 Q• Did you ever go to a Jets/Dolphins game with any of 4 these folks? 5 A. Uh-huh (affirmative response). Yes. 6 Q. Do you know when that was, I mean, was it in this 7 same season? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q• Do you know if during that week you had any 10 conference or meeting with Rothstein? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. So not to confuse the issue: Do you know if you 13 had already met with Scott Rothstein and some other 14 individuals prior to that meeting? 15 MR. KING: Objection to form. Vague. 16 BY MRS. APRIL: 17 Q. You follow what I'm saying? I can rephrase it. 18 A. Rephrase it. 19 Q. Is it accurate to say you had at least two 20 face-to-face meetings where Scott Rothstein was present? 21 A. Before the Jets game? 22 Q. Ever? At any time? 23 A. Yes, that's accurate. 24 Q. And was one of those before the Jets game? 25 A. Yes. United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073698 Page 25 1 Q. And was one after the Jets game? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Do you know if it was soon after, the day after? 4 A. Yeah, it was the day after. 5 Q. Who won the game, do you know? 6 A. I think the Dolphins. 7 Q. So, when you first went to Scott Rothstein's office 8 what was your understanding of the reason you were going 9 there? 10 MR. KING: Is this the first time? 11 MRS. APRIL: The first time. 12 A. We were going to talk more about the confidential 13 settlements. 14 Q. And this was the first time that you heard Scott 15 Rothstein discussing the confidential settlements? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. To the bast of your recollection, what did he say, 18 in substance? I don't mean word for word. 19 A. I can generalize, but I don't remember word for 20 word what was really talked about, you know, specifics. I 21 mean, it was 22 Q. Generalized is fine. 23 MRS. STREETER: I don't want you to guess. 24 BY MRS. APRIL: 25 Q. In other words, did Scott, did he tell you United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073699 Page 26 1 something about the confidential settlements and the process? 2 A. Yes, but it would be more specific to a meeting. 3 The one meeting we had where Barry Bekkedam and George were 4 there it was more of the foundation of: How Barry got there, 5 how George, you know, has been investing, nothing ever 6 tripped up, how we were going to come in and help George, we were going to get a 15 percent return. 8 You know, the meeting after the Jets game, there 9 was a gentleman that flew in to meet Scott who was Thane 10 Ritchey. He was a friend of A.J. DiScala's. He flew in. 11 Scott had invited us to the game, A.J. and I, and we went to 12 the football game. And the next day, it was Thane Ritchey, 13 Michael Legamaro of Morgan, Lewis, Bockius he had flown in 14 that Tuesday morning and A.J. DiScala. 15 Scott at this time was talking about a big case 16 that involved a defendant that had a very large sum of money 17 and had had sex with underaged girls. And he had two girls. 18 Actually, he said it was one at first, very large settlement. 19 And I think the settlement was 18 million. 20 And so that conversation went into with Thane 21 Ritchey, A.J. DiScala and myself and Morgan, Lewis -- Michael 22 Legamaro from Morgan, Lewis to explain to Michael, who A.J. 23 and I soon after hired him to do, you know, the due 24 diligence, you know. 25 Q. Had you ever met Mr. Legamaro before that day? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073700 Page 27 1 A. No. 2 Q. But you understood him to be a lawyer for Thane 3 Ritchey? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. And at that meeting -- Let me make sure I 6 understand who was there. 7 Mr. Legamaro was there, Scott Rothstein was there, 8 Thane Ritchey, A.J. DiScala and you? 9 A. Uh-huh (affirmative response). Yes. 10 Q. Was there anybody else there from Scott Rothstein's 11 firm for any part of the meeting? 12 A. No. 13 Q. At that meeting was it all talk? Let me rephrase 14 that. Was there just discussion or was there an examination 15 of any documents or materials? 16 A. No. 17 Q. In the room with you, were you in the same room 18 that you had been in 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. -- the other time with the larger group? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. Did Scott at that time name the individual that he 23 was referring to who had sex with underaged girls and one 24 case had been settled? 25 A. No. United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073701 Page 28 1 Q. Did you know from the description who he had been 2 talking about? 3 A. No, I had no idea. 4 Q. And did Mk. Legamaro ask questions of Scott 5 Rothstein about the cases? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q• And at that meeting do you know how long it lasted? 8 And I don't mean exactly, but was it an hour, was it all day? 9 Do you know? 10 A. A couple hours. 11 Q. And I believe you said a few minutes ago after that 12 you decided to hire Michael Legamaro, I'm not sure if that's 13 the word you used, retained him? 14 A. Yes, we retained him. 15 Q. Again, who is we in that? 16 A. A.J. DiScala. 17 Q. What did you retain him for? 18 A. To represent Clockwork. 19 Q. Now, again, your lawyer has asked and I'm trying to 20 respect her wishes and not go into too much about what these 21 entities are, but you mentioned Clockwork. What is Clockwork 22 because I had not heard of them before? Are they another 23 fund? 24 A. (No response). 25 Q. Let me rephrase it, because I'm not trying to make United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073702 Page 29 1 your life difficult. Was Clockwork an existing entity at the 2 time that you engaged Mr. Legamaro, whatever it is? I'm not 3 even asking you what it is, but did it exist or do you know? 4 A. I think that's left to be -- You know, it's our 5 question: Was it or wasn't it? 6 Q. All right. Do you know if you had any formal 7 paperwork, an engagement letter signed with Mr. Legamaro? 8 A. I don't know. 9 Q. Do you know if you paid Mr. Legamaro any advanced 10 retainer fees? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. And did he represent you after that? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. And was there ever any time after that that you, 15 again, went to Scott Rothstein's office? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. Can you tell me about when it was or how much time 18 elapsed before you went back? 19 A. I think it was the following week. 20 Q. Let me just go back a little, because getting dates 21 down is sometimes important. The ball game, you went to the 22 Jets/Dolphins game, was that a Monday night game or Sunday 23 night? 24 A. Monday night. 25 Q. Was it October of 2009? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073703 Page 30 1 A. Oh-huh (affirmative response). 2 Q• So it looks to me like there was October 5, 12, 3 19th and 26th were all Mondays. So just for frame of 4 reference one of those - and I guess we could check 5 independently to find out when there was a ball game - one of 6 those, you went the next day and that's the first time you 7 met Michael Legamaro at Scott's office, right? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. Did you actually meet him for the first time in the 10 office or did you convene somewhere else first? 1.1 A. No, I think I met him in the office. 12 Q. And did he bring any other attorneys or paralegals 13 assistants with him? 14 A. No. 15 Q. So then you and A.J. engage him and then you say 16 there's another meeting some days later? 17 A. Michael came back down, Michael Legamaro came back 18 down and went to Scott's office with A.J. 19 Q. And do you know the purpose of that visit? 2C A. Michael was doing due diligence on RRA, on 21 Rothstein's firm, and wanted to spend more time with Scott 22 Rothstein understanding these investments. 23 Q. Were you there at all? 24 A. No, not that meeting. 25 Q. Did A.J. discuss with you what occurred at that United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073704 Page 31 1 meeting? 2 A. In general, he discussed that Michael and Scott 3 met. They got along. Michael understands the nature of the 4 settlements. Everything was going well. Michael had a lot 5 of questions for him and was continuing to investigate and do 6 due diligence on the investments of RRA, et cetera. 7 Basically, it was going well. 8 Q. Do you know if you saw Michael Legamaro at all 9 during that trip he made down here? 10 A. I don't remember. 11 Q. Did you see A.J.? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. Do you know if, did A.J. say whether Mr. Legamaro 14 in that visit to the Scott Rothstein office looked at any 15 documents and/or saw any materials? 16 A. I don't remember. 17 Q. Was there any time after that that you yourself, 18 again, went to Rothstein's office? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. And do you know approximately what date or how much 21 time elapsed from this meeting you just described that you 22 didn't go to? 23 A. I think a week. 24 Q• So about a week later you go to Rothstein's office? 25 A. Uh-huh (affirmative response). United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073705 Page 32 1 Q. And who else is there? 2 A. A.J. DiScala, Michael Legamaro. 3 Q. Anyone else. Thane Ritchey there? 4 A. No. 5 Q. Was Thane Ritchey -- Okay, he wasn't there. 6 So just the four of you were at that meeting? 7 A. As I recall. 8 Q. And what occurred at that meeting? 9 A. Scott was trying to close this deal which was the 3.0 first case. He then told us that the sister of this girl was 11 also involved with this client as well as at this point he 12 told us several girls now, once the first girl went forward 13 and started working with him, he was getting calls from other 14 girls saying that I, too, was, you know, involved with this 15 client. And so -- 16 Q. When you say the client, you mean the law firm -- 17 A. I'm sorry, the defendant. And so Scott was all 18 fired up saying, We've gotta get the first one. We've got a 19 total of 18, you know, girls and now we've got the first one 20 that we need to close. But now the sister, you know, he can 21 get the sister negotiated and taken care of. 22 At this point it was -- we were -- I'm trying to 23 understand the whole deal. It was a large sum of money. At 24 this point we were calling it bullshit. How can one person 25 get a settlement for 18 million. United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073706 Page 33 1 So Scott at this point said, Okay, you guys are 2 here. I'm going to trust you. I'm going to open the case. 3 I'm going to bring it down and I'll let you see who this 4 person is. 5 At this point Thane was also, you're talking about 6 maybe a two-week time period of, you know, Thane was talking 7 about making a $5 million investment. So Michael was already 8 in the process of doing his due diligence and things that he 9 needed to do. So Scott called for the evidence of who this 10 person was. We were in Scott's office, his personal office 11 in RRA, and 10, 15 minutes later in walks our former Sheriff 12 Ken Jenne with another gentleman, I didn't know who he was, 13 bringing in several boxes which ended to be I think about 14 19. 15 Q. Were the boxes marked or numbered? 16 Uh 17 Q. You know sometimes boxes say 1 of 10, 2 of 10? I 18 mean, any numbering like that? 19 I don't remember. 20 Q. So Mr. Jenne walks in with someone else with the 21 boxes and what does he do? 22 A. They start bringing all the boxes and they start 23 laying them -- You know, as you walk in there was a, you 24 know, almost as if you walked into this room. He was putting 25 all the boxes against the wall here and they were stacked, United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073707 Page 34 1 what ended up being 19 boxes. So it was a lot of 2 information. 3 Q. Were these like banker's boxes that you put files 4 in? 5 A. Yes. Yes. 6 Q. Then what happened? Did Jenne leave? 7 A. Yeah, he left. Scott had pulled some certain information from the case files and said, you know, I'm going 9 to tell you about who he is. I need the utmost confidence in 10 this as this is an open case. It's an ongoing case. This 11 person has other issues. He's just getting out of -- either 12 he was in jail or just getting out of jail. So he kind of 13 set the stage of who this person was. He already had a track 14 record. He already had issues. It was already public. You 15 could Google it. 16 And these girls that came forward would not come 17 forward before and that was the, you know, confidential 18 nature of, you know, Scott saying I've got 18 of these girls 19 lined up and here is this person. His name is Jeffrey 20 Epstein. 21 Q. And at that moment had you heard of Jeffrey 22 Epstein? 23 A. No. 24 Q. Had the others who were there in the room 25 commented, you said that A.J. DiScala was there? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073708 Page 35 1 A. Uh-huh (affirmative response). 2 Q. Did he act like he knew who Jeffrey Epstein was? 3 A. I don't think any of us knew who he was. 4 Q. So what happened after Scott said that? 5 A. Scott had some flight records I guess from Jeffrey 6 Epstein's plane or planes, I don't know if there were 7 multiple, but there were flight records. It seemed to be 8 from, you know, a company that took the logs of them. Again, 9 I don't know if it was his actual company or the flight 10 company. 11 Scott started talking about some of the issues of 12 why he was going to be able to get these large sums of money, 13 number one. This gentleman, Jeffrey Epstein, is supposed to 14 be -- Scott said he's got over a four and a half billion 15 dollar networth of what Scott could -- what was kind of known 16 publicly. 17 There were also people on these plane rides that 18 were known figures that definitely would not want this 19 information getting out and that the nature of the settlement 20 would, they would want to -- Jeffrey Epstein would want to 21 keep this quiet and that there was already pressures on him 22 to keep it quiet. 23 Q. Would want to keep what quiet? 24 A. The fact that there were underaged girls on these 25 planes and there were other people on these planes and they United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073709 Page 36 1 were public figures. 2 Q. Did you actually see these supposed flight logs? 3 A. Yes, a few of them. 4 Q. Did you recognize any names on them? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Can you say who any of them were? 7 A. Bill Clinton. Naomi Campbell, which I think she's 8 a super model. There was a reported Sheik, I don't remember 9 who it was but, obviously, an important person, a very 10 wealthy person. 11 Q. And it's your understanding that on these plane 12 trips there were underaged girls? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. Did you find out the names of any of the girls? 15 A. No, but I remember Scott was explaining because all the other people had their names written out but the girls. 17 It was just their first name and the first letter of their 18 last name. So if it was Sara, Sara something, it was Sara C. 19 Q. I see. So, there were these boxes in the room. 20 And were these flight logs removed from the boxes that Mr. 21 Jenne and the other gentlemen brought in or did Scott have 22 those separate? 23 A. Scott had those separate. 24 Q. Did he show you anything else by way of materials? 25 A. Yes. But they were, I think they were pieces of United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073710 Page 37 1 his former accusations of former, you know, arrest records 2 and news clippings and some other things. 3 Q. Did you have a look at some of those? 4 A. Very quickly. 5 Q. Did anybody else in the room with you scrutinize 6 them more closely? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. Who? 9 A. Michael Legamaro with Morgan, Lewis, Bockius, the 10 attorney. 11 Q. Do you know what City Mr. Legamaro bases his 12 practice in? 13 A. Chicago, Illinois. 14 Q. Did you ever visit him there? 15 A. No. 16 Q. Did Mr. Legamaro comment about any of the items 17 that he looked at in your presence in front of Scott 18 Rothstein? 19 A. Oh, yeah. 20 Q. Can you tell us what he said then? 21 A. Yeah, he went through the boxes. Scott said you 22 guys can look at the boxes, just don't take any of the 23 information, don't pull it out and misplace it from the 24 files. 25 So Michael Legamaro did spend, you know, some time United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073711 Page 38 1 looking through a lot of the boxes and the files and said, 2 you know, This is a real case. And he explained that as a 3 young attorney he used to be an attorney for the United 4 States and I think he termed it as a jag attorney, which I 5 don't really know what that stands for, but he used to 6 prosecute for, I think he said, child molestation, underage, 7 you know, things of this nature which are -- I don't know 8 the word I'm looking for. 9 Q. Abuse? 10 A. Yeah, abuse. I would just put heightened concern, 11 you know, touchy subjects. I don't know if that's the -- 12 Q. So he told you something about his past experience 13 with cases of that nature? 14 A. Yes. He gave in that description, gave us 15 confidence that he knew what he was looking at. 16 Q. Did he ask for copies of anything that he looked 17 at? 18 A. I don't think so. 19 Q. Did he make any notes such as we -- 20 A. I don't remember. 21 Q. You said he made a remark along the lines of, This 22 is a real case. Did you understand he only was looking at 23 one case? 24 MR. KING: Objection. Leading. 25 A. Repeat the question. United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073712 Page 39 1 Q. Did you understand, do you know if he looked at 2 more than one case file? 3 A. I don't know. 4 Q. Do you know if Mr. Legamaro, do you know how at 5 that time he was able to confirm that this is a real case? 6 A. I'm not an attorney. I don't know. 7 Q. Did he have a laptop with him? 8 A. I don't remember. 9 Q. Do you recall him at any time whether on his own 10 computer or one made available to him where he punched up 11 some numbers to look at any of the cases online, if you 12 remember? 13 A. That's a good question. 14 MRS. STREETER: Don't guess. 15 THE WITNESS: I know. 16 A. I don't remember. 17 Q. Do you know how much time you spent at the 18 Rothstein office that day when Michael Legamaro was looking 19 at these files? 20 A. Hour and a half, two hours max. We had Thane 21 Ritchey on the phone. 22 Q. Oh, okay. Was he on the phone the whole time? 23 A. Not, not the whole time. 24 Q. Was there any other conversation other than what 25 you've described between Scott Rothstein and any of you at United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073713 Page 40 1 that gathering? 2 A. I'm sorry. Ask again. 3 Q. Other than what you've already testified to about 4 what Scott said and what Mr. Legamaro said, do you recall any 5 other conversation that occurred at that gathering? 6 A. (No response). 7 For example, you said Mr. Ritchey was on the phone. 8 Did he ask questions? 9 MR. KING: Objection. Compound. Unless you're 10 just focusing on that last question. 11 BY MRS. APRIL: 12 Q. Well, did he ask any questions? Let's focus on 13 that one. 14 A. He did. I don't remember specifics. 15 Q. Is there anything else that was said by anybody at 16 that meeting that you remember today concerning the 17 settlements or Mr. Epstein that you haven't already testified 18 about. 19 A. Yes, at that meeting A.J. DiScala had disclosed 20 that his friend, Ted Waite, is dating the girl or a girl that 21 used to date Jeffrey Epstein and that he knows from prior 22 conversations with Ted that Jeffrey wasn't the, you know, was 23 kind of known to be a, you know, womanizer, a cheater, this 24 kind of -- this would fall in line with his character. A.J. 25 said he was going to call Ted and see if he could talk to United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073714 Page 41 Ted's girlfriend. 2 Q. Did A.J. say that in front of Rothstein? 3 Yeah. 4 Q. And do you know if A.J. -- did A.J. ever tell you 5 that he did speak to Ted Waite or the girlfriend? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. What did he tell you about that? 8 A. He spoke to Ted. Ted got really pissed off at 9 him. 10 Q. At A.J.? 11 A. Oh, yeah. 12 Q. Because? 13 A. He just felt that, from what A.J. said to me, he 14 just felt A.J. was out of line and, you know, he didn't want 15 his girlfriend being questioned about, you know, this stuff 16 and to, you know, mind his own business. 17 Q. And did he, as far as you know, after that not 18 involve the girlfriend? 19 A. I don't know. 20 Q. Do you know her name? 21 A. No. 22 Q. Did you ever meet this Ted Waite? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. Does he live in New York? 25 A. No, he lives in San Diego. United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073715 Page 42 1 Q. Have you ever met the girlfriend of Ted Waite who 2 used to be Jeffrey Epstein's girlfriend? 3 A. No. 4 Q. Anything else that you recall that was said during 5 this meeting that you haven't already testified about? 6 A. Not that I can think of. 7 Q. If you remember, at the conclusion of this meeting 8 was there any decision made about you going forward with the 9 investment or requiring additional time to decide? 10 A. It was our conclusion, really, based off of Michael 11 Legamaro's feelings, comments and, you know, him being a 12 respect -- what I thought was a respected attorney from a 13 very respected firm, he had high confidence this is a real 14 case and, you know, it could be that there are several of 15 these cases that were real. Potentially, you know, 18 16 plaintiffs. He gave us the confidence to go forward and 17 invest. 18 Q. Did Scott Rothstein offer you any estimate of how 19 much money these settlements would be worth in his opinion, 20 total? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. Do you remember the number? 23 A. It was over 300 million. 24 Q. After that did you have any other, was there ever 25 any other time that you were in Scott Rothstein's office? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073716 Page 43 1 A. I don't think so. 2 Q. You mentioned earlier something called Clockwork. 3 And without going into any particulars about what Clockwork 4 is: Did Clockwork make an investment in these Epstein 5 so-called settlements or potential settlements, if you 6 know? 7 MRS. STREETER: Do you want to step outside for a 8 minute? 9 THE WITNESS: Yes. 10 (WHEREUPON, an off-the-record discussion was had). 11 BY MRS. APRIL: 12 Q. Before that break, you were talking about a meeting 13 at Scott Rothstein's personal office. You said you were 14 always in the same office when you went to his firm? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Did any particular person at the firm ever, like, 17 escort you into the office or greet you? 18 A. Scott's secretary. 19 Q. Did you know her name? 2C A. No, she's a Latin girl. 21 Q. Did you, again, visit Scott Rothstein's office 22 after the meeting you described with Mr. Legamaro looking at 23 documents and things in boxes? 24 A. Not that I recall. 25 Q. Let me clarify something. So, am I to understand United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073717 Page 44 1 that you were in Scott's office on three occasions? 2 A. Yeah. 3 Q. These boxes that former Sheriff Jenne and another 4 individual brought in, were they available for your review on 5 more than one of those meetings? 6 A. (No response). 7 Q. I know it's been awhile and there's a lot that went 8 on at that time. 9 A. Yeah, I'm just going through it in my head. I was 10 there one time after and it was -- I don't remember exact 11 dates, how many days after, but I was there one time after. 12 Q. And do you know who you were with? Was Mr. 13 Rothstein there, of course? 14 A. Of course. 15 Q. Anyone else? 16 A. A.J. DiScala. 17 Q. Was Mr. Legamaro with you at that time? 18 A. I don't remember. 19 Q. Was Thane Ritchey there? 20 A. No. 21 Q. And at that other visit to the Rothstein office 22 were the boxes in the same location in his office? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. And you mentioned that when they were brought in 25 they were stacked up against the wall, but was there some United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073718 Page 45 1 point -- 2 A. They weren't stacked up. They were just all on the 3 ground, stacked next to each other but not stacked up. 4 Q. So when Mr. Legamaro looked at things in them did 5 he actually bend down on the floor to look or did he put them 6 on the table? 7 A. I know he bent over. I don't remember if he put 8 them on the table. 9 Q. Did you, for the several items that you described 10 that you looked at briefly, do you know if you put some on 11 the table or if you, you know, scooted down on the floor to 12 look at them? 13 A. I scooted on the floor or bent over. I didn't put 14 anything on the table. I really, you know, felt personally a 15 little uncomfortable because, number one, I didn't know what 16 I was looking at. I don't know what I'm looking at, you 17 know, or looking for. 18 Q. Do you know the reason you went back this time that 19 you're describing when you said you went back one other time 20 with A.J. and possibly Mr. Legamaro, was it to continue the 21 due diligence or the examination of the file? 22 A. I don't remember. 23 Q. Do you know how you came to know about any of these 24 meetings? In other words, did you get an e-mail or a 25 telephone call or some other communication? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073719 Page 46 1 A. Most of it was A.J.. A.J. was more of the one that 2 was, for lack of a better word, the ring leader. 3 Q. He was setting up the appointments? 4 A. Yeah. 5 Q. Did he telephone you? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. Did A.J. come down here regularly during the Fall 8 of 2009? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. Where did he stay? 11 A. My house. 12 Q. Did you live at the same address that you live at 13 presently? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. Did A.J., to your recollection, ever send you 16 e-mails about visits to the Rothstein firm to set them up or 17 remind you or anything like that? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. Did you ever receive any e-mails from Scott 20 Rothstein directly? 21 A. I think I was copied. 22 Q. Did you ever send any e-mails to Scott Rothstein? 23 A. A couple. 24 Q. And was it concerning the investment he was 25 offering? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073720 Page 47 1 A. I sent him a thank you e-mail for the football 2 game, Monday night game, and I don't remember what else. 3 Q. Did you ever have Scott's personal cell phone 4 number? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Did you ever call him? 7 A. Maybe three times. 8 Q. Do you know what about? 9 A. One was on a personal matter. The other two may 10 have been for a meeting. 11 Q. When you say about a meeting, you mean a meeting 12 related to these investment opportunities? 13 A. Yeah. If A.J. couldn't get ahold of him, he would 14 have me call. 15 Q. So did Scott, to your knowledge, make these 16 appointments on his own as opposed to through his 17 secretary? 18 MRS. STREETER: If you know. 19 A. Sometimes he did. 20 Q. How did you first meet A.J. DiScala? 21 A. I was introduced to A.J. from a friend of mine 22 named Joe Gamborelli (phonetic). 23 Q. And when was that? 24 A. That was in around October of 2008. 25 Q. Was that when you were in New York? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073721 Page 48 1 A. September of -- Yeah, when I first got up there. 2 Joe lives in New York. 3 Q. Did you ever work with A.J. after that, I mean, 4 like -- Let me rephrase that. 5 Did you ever have any business dealings with A.J. 6 prior to the investment we've been talking about? 7 A. I looked at a couple of things. I never invested 8 in the deals he did. 9 Q. And what was his occupation when you met him? 10 A. Good question. 11 Q. Or what did you 12 A. Investment banker. 13 Q. Okay. Sometimes that question should be: What did 14 you understand his occupation to be? Investment banker? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Was he with a firm? 17 A. No, he was on his own. 18 Q. Does he live in New York, to your knowledge? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. Have you been to his home? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. Where does he live? 23 A. Exact address? 24 Q. Whatever you know. 25 A. I've probably got it in my phone. I don't know his United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073722 Page 49 1 exact address off the top of my head. 2 Q. But is it an apartment building, is it uptown or 3 downtown? 4 A. It's near Tribeca. He lives in an apartment, he 5 doesn't own it. 6 Q. Going back to the documents that Michael Legamaro 7 looked at and files when you were in Scott Rothstein's 8 office: Are you able to say what he specifically looked at, 9 in other words, whether they were court papers or whether 10 they were some other kind of papers? 11 A. Of what Michael Legamaro looked at? 12 Q. Yes. 13 A. He looked through many of the boxes. I think there 14 were, you know, court papers. 15 MRS. STREETER: Do you know what they were? 16 A. Not specifically, no. 17 Q. When I say court papers, I'm talking about things 18 that are actually filed in court like I had shown you before, 19 the beginning of this complaint, the Razorback complaint. 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. Do you know if he looked at any papers that are 22 styled this way with a court name on them, a plaintiff and a 23 defendant? 24 A. I was not with him when he actually was looking at 25 that piece of paper. I only heard comments of what he said, United Reporting, be. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073723 Page 50 1 so I can't say for certain. 2 Q. Was there any time when he said to you or to A.J., 3 Oh, take a look at this. It shows -- Anything in particular? 4 A. I don't remember the particulars. 5 Q. I think you said he did not take any notes that you 6 recall? 7 A. Correct. 8 Q. Did you take any notes? 9 A. No. 10 Q. Did A.J. take any notes that you saw? 11 A. No. 12 Q. Did Scott Rothstein take any notes of what was 13 going on, to your knowledge? 14 A. No. 15 Q. Did Scott show you any other -- When he was making 16 his sales, was this sort of a sales pitch he was doing? 17 A. Yeah. 18 Q. Did he show you any, you know, charts or 19 powerpoints or presentations in addition to these files? 20 A. No. 21 Q. Did he play any tapes for you? 22 A. No. 23 Q. Did he advise you that he used investigators to 24 obtain information about Mr. Epstein? 25 A. Yes. United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073724 Page 51 1 Q. What did he tell you about that, just that he used 2 them? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. Did he say that he had had any telephone 5 conversations taped of Mr. Epstein? 6 A. I don't recall. 7 Q. Did he tell you who the investigators were? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. Do you recall their names? 10 A. Ken Jenne, Mike Fisten. 11 Q. Do you know if Mike Fisten was the other person 12 that helped Ken Jenne deliver the boxes of material to the 13 Rothstein office you were in? 14 A. I don't know. 15 Q. Do you know Mike Fisten when you see him? I mean, 16 have you ever seen him to your knowledge? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. So if he were to walk in here now would you 19 recognize him? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. Did you ever meet him? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. Where? 24 A. Outside of Scott's office with Ken Jenne. 25 Q. Who introduced you? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073725 Page 52 1 A. Scott. 2 Q. Did he introduce you with a description of what Mr. 3 Fisten did for the firm? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. What did he say he did? 6 A. That they were, you know, there to do investigative 7 work on the cases. 8 Q. Did he boast about any techniques they used? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. What do you recall that he said? 11 A. That was one of Scott's sales pitches in general 12 about his investigative team and that you have to be cautious 13 of what you put in your trash can, it's not shredded and 14 cross-shredded. They would take video surveillance if they 15 had to, sit outside homes, watch patterns, watch where they 16 go. I think that's all I remember. 17 Q. Did he tell you that they had Mr. Epstein under 18 surveillance for further opportunities? 19 A. No, I don't remember. 20 Q• Who else, if anyone, did you ever meet at the 21 Rothstein firm when you would go to Scott's office? Do you 22 remember? 23 A. Yeah. 24 Q. Let me withdraw that question for a moment and just 25 ask you about some names. Did you ever meet Stuart United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073726 Page 53 1 Rosenfeld? 2 A. Briefly. 3 Q. At the office or outside? 4 A. At the office. 5 Q. What was the circumstance, did Scott bring him in? 6 A. No. We were passing through the hallway and Scott 7 just introduced him. We were walking by and that was it. 8 Q. So it was merely an introduction? 9 A. Yeah, if that. I mean, he wouldn't know who I was 10 or he didn't say specifically this is Dean Kretschmar. 171 Q. What about Russell Adler, did you ever meet him? 12 A. No. 13 Q. What about Debra Villegas? 14 A. No. 15 Q. Did you ever meet anyone there called, I'm not sure 16 I'm saying his name right, Frank Preve or Preve? 17 MRS. STREETER: Preve. 18 BY MRS. APRIL: 19 Q. Who is Frank Preve? 20 A. Frank Preve was with Banyon and worked for George 21 Levin. 22 Q. And where did you meet him? 23 A. At George Levin's offices. 24 Q. And where was George Levin's office? 25 A. Off of Sunrise across from the Galleria Mall. United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073727 Page 54 1 Q. Did you ever see Frank Preve at the Rothstein firm 2 when you visited those offices? 3 A. He was in the first meeting that I described Barry 4 Bekkedam was there, George Levin, Frank Preve. I did say 5 Frank Preve's name. That was the only time that I saw him. 6 Q. Do you know what his role was with Banyan? 7 A. He was George's right-hand man. He was the one 8 that sent you your statement. That's where my first 9 investment was through. He was the contact person with 10 Banyon Investment Income Fund. 11 Q. Did you ever meet anybody named Soden, B-o-d-e-n? 12 A. No. 13 Q. Are you affiliated with D3 Capital Club, LLC? 14 A. Describe what you mean affiliated? 15 Q. Well, do you own any part? 16 A. No. 17 Q. Do you know what it is? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. What is it? 20 A. It was an investment vehicle for the last 21 investment of this certain Epstein case. 22 Q. Does D3 stand for any particular thing, if you 23 know? 24 A. (No response). 25 Q. I mean, for example, like names DiScala, Dean, United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073728 Page 55 1 Doug, anything? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. It does stand for names? 4 A. Uh-huh (affirmative response). 5 Q. I'm going to ask you about some other individuals. 6 You had mentioned at the first meeting that the Banyon, with 7 Barry and Banyon people that were at Rothstein's office, that 8 there were a number of people in addition to those you named. 9 I think you said the room was, the table was filled pretty 10 much? 11 A. Uh-huh (affirmative response). 12 Q. Was John Antolik present, if you recall? 13 A. I don't remember. 14 Q. Do you know who that person is? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Who was he? 17 A. He is, he knows A.J. DiScala. 18 Q. Was he an individual who had an interest in 19 investing in Banyon, do you know? 20 A. Not Banyon. 21 Q. Any other investment that 22 A. Razorback. 23 Q. Are you saying he did invest in Razorback, to your 24 knowledge? 25 A. Yes. United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073729 Page 56 1 Q. Chris Podaras, do you know someone by that name? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Do you know if he was at any of the meetings in 4 Rothstein's office? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Was he at what I'll call the first one, the large 7 group with Barry? 8 A. I don't remember. 9 Q. How do you know Chris? 10 A. I know Chris through A.J. 11 Q. Did he invest, to your knowledge, in Razorback or 12 any fund? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. Have you ever done business with Chris Podaras? 15 A. Outside of this investment, no. 16 Q. Do you know someone named Jim Parrish? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. Do you know if he was at any meeting at the 19 Rothstein firm? 20 A. I don't remember. 21 Q. Do you know if he invested in Razorback? 22 A. I don't think so. 23 Q. Do you know if he invested in any product offered 24 by or opportunity offered by Scott Rothstein? 25 A. I don't think so. United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073730 Page 57 1 Q. How do you know him? 2 A. Through A.J. DiScala. 3 Q. Do you know if he lives in New York or Florida? 4 A. Yes, he lives in New York. 5 Q. Do you know if he has a business affiliation, is he 6 with a firm or a company? 7 A. I think he's on his own. 8 Q. Michael Christ, is that name known to you? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. Who is he? 11 A. He works for AIG which is an investment group. 12 Q. Do you recall if he was ever present at any meeting 13 in Scott Rothstein's office? 14 A. I don't recall. 15 Q. Do you know if Scott Rothstein ever told you or 16 others in your presence that there was any kind of insurance 17 in connection with the investments in the settlement 18 opportunity? 19 A. No. 20 Q. Did anyone tell you there was insurance? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. Who? 23 A. Barry Bekkedam, Frank Preve and George Levin. 24 Q. And did they tell you this on separate occasions or 25 at one sitting, at one time? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073731 Page 58 1 A. Separate occasions. 2 Q. And what did you understand the insurance was and 3 the amount? 4 A. I understood it was 70 million. It was, basically, 5 a fraud and crime policy. 6 Q. Do you know if there ever was a fraud and crime 7 policy purchased? 8 A. I was told there was. 9 Q. Did you make a claim under that policy, if you 10 know? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. Do you know if that is a pending matter? 13 A. Pending matter. 14 Q. So you understand that it's Banyon that had the 15 insurance? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. Did Michael Legamaro, did he ever ask - again, not 18 just privately with you but in front of either Scott 19 Rothstein or somebody who he did not represent - whether the 20 investment, whether there was any insurance in place for the 21 investment? 22 A. I don't remember. 23 Q. Do you know someone named Al Rappetti? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. And who is Mr. Rappetti? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073732 Page 59 1 A. He worked for Ballamor. 2 Q. That's Barry Bekkedam's firm? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. How do you spell that, Ballamor? 5 MRS. STREETER: B-a-1-1-a-m-o-r. 6 MRS. APRIL: Is it on there? 7 MRS. STREETER: Yeah. 8 BY MRS. APRIL: 9 Q. Now, forgive me, i don't think I asked you this. 10 There's a lot of names I've been asking you about. Thane 11 Ritchey, how did you originally meet him? A. I originally met him at the Monday night football game. He met us. Is he a friend of A.J. DiScalas. 14 Q. Is this the game we talked about earlier, the 3.5 Dolphins/Jets game down here in October of 2009? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. And you met him at the game? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. Did A.J. tell you before the game anything about 20 Thane Ritchey? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. What did he tell you? 23 A. That Thane was, Thane's father was a pretty 24 prominent figure on Wallstreet as an investor. Thane had a 25 two billion plus fund himself for various investments. They United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073733 Page 60 1 were both involved in -- I think A.J. brought him to Tom 2 Petter's investment, which turned out to be a ponzi scheme. 3 Q. This is what A.J. was telling you by way of 4 background of Thane Ritchey? 5 A. Yeah. And he has a big hedge fund. 6 Q. That's the two billion dollar fund you're talking 7 about? 8 A. Yeah. 9 Q. Do you know what it's called? 10 A. Ritchey Capital. 11 Q. Did you speak with Thane Ritchey about investing 12 with Scott Rothstein when you met him at the football game? 13 A. No. 14 Q. Did you speak with him at some time after that 15 about investing? :6 A. No. 17 Q. Did you ever borrow money from Thane Ritchey to 18 invest in the, well, in the Epstein settlements, the products 19 that Rothstein offered? 20 THE WITNESS: Maxine? 21 MRS. STREETER: Sure. 22 MRS. APRIL: Off the record for a couple of 23 minutes. 24 (WHEREUPON, an off-the-record discussion was had). 25 MRS. STREETER: I just want to say something, back United Reporting,Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073734 Page 61 1 on the record, Mr. Kretschmar has advised me that his 2 business dealings with Mr. Ritchey are involved in 3 present litigation right now. His lawyer is not present 4 to advise him. It's the subject of ongoing litigation and he's not comfortable answering any of these 6 questions. He's not going to answer any more. 7 MRS. APRIL: Let's defer on all of that. Let me S just say since we're on the record that rather than, 9 that we will not cover that today. And in the event 10 that that litigation resolves itself and it becomes 11 necessary in this case to re-depose him on certain 12 issues, we reserve that right. 13 MRS. STREETER: That's fine. 14 BY MRS. APRIL: 15 Q. I think you testified previously that you were not 16 told the names of any of the alleged victims of Mr. Epstein 17 who were the plaintiffs in these cases that were being 18 projected as large settlements? 19 A. Uh-huh (affirmative response). 20 Q. But you understood that there were 17 or 18 girls 21 who were going to be making claims against Mr. Epstein? 22 A. Uh-huh (affirmative response). 23 Q. Other than Mr. Epstein, did Scott Rothstein at any 24 of these meetings or times that you spoke with him or he 25 spoke to you talk about other defendants? In other words, United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073735 Page 62 1 cases that didn't involve Jeff Epstein? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. And did you get any description of the defendants, 4 if not by name, by characterization? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. What did he tell you? 7 A. About the same time as this case, he was telling us about another case he didn't have but he thought he was going 9 to get, and it was a American company that did some wrongful 10 acts in South America and it was related to Dole Pineapple. 11. Q. Did you ever hear of the term Qui Tam case? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. Do you remember if Scott discussed any of the Qui 14 Tam case with you? 15 A. I think that may have been one of the Qui Tam 16 cases. 17 Q• Was Mr. Legamaro present when Scott Rothstein 18 discussed that case or cases? 19 A. I don't remember. 20 Q. Were you given any papers or including like an 21 offering memorandum or prospectus by Scott Rothstein? 22 A. No. 23 Q. Do you know if any of your colleagues that you 24 were -- like A.J. DiScala were given any offering papers or 25 prospectus by Scott Rothstein? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073736 Page 63 1 A. I don't know. 2 Q. What about Mr. Legamaro, did he receive any 3 documents from Scott Rothstein or someone on behalf of Scott 4 Rothstein? 5 A. I don't know. 6 Q. When is the last time you ever spoke to Scott 7 Rothstein, if not the exact date, the approximate time? You 8 are free to look at the calendar if that helps you. 9 A. I think this was that last meeting. 10 Q. And that was late-October? 11 A. Yeah. 12 Q. Did you ever meet someone named Halle, H-a-1-1-e, 13 on or about the last week of October, 2009? 14 A. Somebody by the name of Halle? 15 Q. Yes. 16 A. Is that a first name, last name? 17 Q. Well, Warren Halle? 18 A. Warren Halle? 19 Q. Well, let me try a different question. Do you know 20 someone named Buddy Hack? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. Who is that? 23 A. He works for Larson. 24 Q. The boat dock company? 25 A. Yeah. United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073737 Page 64 1 Q. Ships, yachts? I'm not sure. Larson? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Do you know if he introduced you to someone named 4 Warren Halle or Halle? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Do you know under what circumstances you met this 7 gentleman? 8 A. We met with him, my stepfather and I, and A.J. 9 DiScala at my father's house, stepfather's house, same person 10 in this case. And we told him about the investment, but he 11 ended up not investing. 12 Q. Do you know if that was after you last visited the 13 Rothstein office? 14 A. I don't remember. 15 Q. Was it during any kind of a event at a boat show or 16 any -- 17 A. Yeah, it was a boat show. 18 Q. Early in your testimony you mentioned Michael 19 Szafranski I think and I believe you said, without me going 20 back to my exact notes, that he had something to do with 21 verifying the Rothstein firm's representations for Banyon or 22 for Ballamor. Do you know who hired him? 23 A. From my understanding, it was Platinum Centurion. 24 Q. And what's Platinum Centurion? 25 A. They're a hedge fund in New York. United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073738 Page 65 1 Q. And is there any individual who you ever talked to 2 who was with Platinum Centurion other than Szafranski? 3 A. I don't understand your question. 4 Q. Well, in other words, when you talk about Platinum 5 Centurion, is there an individual that you believe to be the 6 operator of those funds? 7 A. Oh, I don't know. I was told Platinum Centurion by 8 George Levin and Frank Preve. 9 Q. But you did meet Szafranski, right? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. Did I understand you said he was at the first 12 meeting in Scott's office or do you know? 13 A. I don't know. 14 Q. Where did you meet him in New York or down here? 15 A. Down here. 16 Q. Do you know where you were when you met him? 17 A. He had an office in RRA on a different floor. 18 Q. And RRA is Rothstein, Rosenfeld & Adler? 19 A. Correct. 20 Q. Did it strike you as odd that a third party who was 21 sent to verify the bonafides of the Rothstein office had an 22 office in that firm? 23 MRS. STREETER: Objection as to form. You can 24 answer. 25 A. Yes and no. It wasn't on RRA's main floor, but it United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073739 Page 66 1 was a few floors down and didn't seem to be a very important 2 area of their firm. 3 Q. Do you think it might have been an office they were 4 letting him use for whatever he was doing there? 5 A. Yeah. 6 Q. Did Scott Rothstein ask you or, well, did he ever 7 ask you to bring in other investors to this deal he was 8 pitching? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. Did he offer you any additional benefit if you 11 brought others in? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. What was that? 14 A. It was a higher percentage than 15 percent, but I 15 don't remember the exact percentage. It was different. 16 Q. And when you say 15 percent, is that the return you 17 were promised on the investment? 18 A. Banyon. 19 Q. And Banyon? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. So how much money did you put in Banyon? 22 A. 8.4 million. 23 Q. And then you also said you invested in other ways, 24 was that with the same promised return? 25 A. Of the 15 percent? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073740 Page 67 1 Q. Yes. 2 A. I invested in Razorback. I don't remember then 3 what the exact return was on that. I think it was higher 4 than the 15. 5 Q• But Razorback was also an investment with Rothstein 6 based on the same kinds of settlements as the one you were 7 looking at with respect to Epstein, is that correct? Let me 8 rephrase that. 9 Was the prototype, the nature of the investment, 10 the settlements the same for Razorback as it was going to be 11 for your later investment for D3? 12 A. They weren't the same in the sense that if one was 13 a confidential settlement for a company versus -- We went 14 off of what Scott was telling us what he was negotiating. So 15 there wasn't a standard, you know, return per se other than 16 what George Levin was offering us at the first initial 17 investment of Banyon, which was a set 15 percent. 18 Q. And the first investment with Banyon did you have a 19 prospectus or an offer of memorandum? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. How did you learn that you had been defrauded, I 22 think that's the word you used earlier in your deposition 23 today? How did you first hear about that? 24 A. A.J. had received a e-mail from Scott Rothstein 25 saying to stay away and that, basically, he wasn't right, he United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073741 Page 68 1 was sorry and it's best to stay away from him. 2 And then we called -- Well, I shouldn't say we. 3 A.J. called Frank Preve and said, What's going on? And so 4 George Levin and Frank were in conversations with Scott. 5 Q. When A.J. got this e-mail from Scott did he show it 6 to you or forward it to you? 7 A. Yeah. Yeah, he showed it to me. 8 Q. And did it make sense to you? 9 A. No. 10 Q. Did you understand that -- Well, what did it mean 11 to you? Let me retract that and ask a different question. 12 What happened after that? You said that A.J. spoke 13 to Preve? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. And what did he learn from that communication that 16 he shared with you? 17 MRS. STREETER: I'm going to -- I just want to put 18 on the record, again, that you're going into areas that 19 are part of our case and involving our litigation. I 20 mean, he's here to talk about Epstein. I'm not 21 comfortable with this line of questioning. 22 BY MRS. APRIL: 23 Q. Well, let me ask you this: I'm not sure that they 24 don't blend together, but let me 25 Do you know, do you know what happened after that United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073742 Page 69 1 with respect to your investment? You had already made some 2 investments, right, at that point that this e-mail was sent? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. Did you have other investments that were in process 5 or that were halted, can you tell me what happened to your -- 6 Let me backup. 7 When did you decide, if you did, to invest in the 8 group of settlements that I'll describe as the Epstein 9 settlements? 10 A. I didn't make an investment in the Epstein 11 settlements. 12 Q. You never made that investment? 13 A. No. 14 Q. Were you going to or did you never get to the point 15 where you decided? 16 A. I basically didn't have any more money to invest. 17 Q. Did Scott Rothstein ever ask you to sign any 18 agreement or anything that you wouldn't discuss what was said 19 to you in his office about the Epstein cases or any other 20 cases? 21 A. No. 22 Q. Did he ever say you could not take notes of what 23 you were looking at if you chose to look at those files? 24 A. I don't recall. 25 Q. Do you know who Elizabeth Friedland is? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073743 Page 70 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. Who is she? 3 A. She was A.J.'s secretary. 4 Q. And did A.J. have a company called Clockwork 5 Capital Advisors in New York City? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. And to your knowledge was that his -- did she work 8 for that company? 9 A. I don't know. 10 Q. When is the last time, if you remember, that you 11 spoke with A.J. DiScala? 12 A. Eight months ago. 13 Q. Do you know if he still has Clockwork as a -- if 14 Clockwork Capital Advisors still operates? 15 A. I don't know. 16 Q. Do you know an attorney named Chris Roman? 17 A. No. 18 Q. Do you know a firm named Clifford, Chance? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. Do you know how you are acquainted with that firm 21 at all? 22 MRS. STREETER: Can we take a break for a second? 23 I want to talk to you. 24 MRS. APRIL: Sure. I think he needs to answer the 25 question first if he can or not. United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073744 Page 71 1 BY MRS. APRIL: 2 Q. Do you happen to know who Clifford, Chance is? 3 A. A.J. spoke with him and dealt with Clifford, 4 Chance. 5 MRS. APRIL: Give me just a second and then we can 6 take that break you were talking about. 7 BY MRS. APRIL: 8 Q. Do you know someone named Adam Fisher? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. Who is Mr. Fisher? 11 A. Who is Adam fisher? 12 Q. Yes. A. Adam is another friend of A.J. DiScalas or knows 14 A.J. DiScala. 15 Q. Do you know if he was ever at any meeting that you 16 attended at the Rothstein firm? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. Yes, he was there? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. Was it the first one when you were with the Banyon 21 people? 22 A. I don't recall. 23 Q. Do you know if anybody invested in the settlements 24 that we've described as the Epstein settlements that Scott 25 Rothstein was trying to sell as an investment? United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073745 Page 72 1 A. I'm sorry, do I -- 2 Q. Do you know if anyone invested in it? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. Who? 5 A. My father invested in that, *Mercato Jew (STA), and 6 I don't know if any -- I don't know any others. 7 Q. I promise, we are going to take a break in a 8 second, but what's *Mercato Jew [STA]? 9 A. That's an organization that Thane Ritchey owns. 10 MRS. APRIL: Let's take a couple of minutes and 11 then I'm going to be wrapping up soon any way. 12 (WHEREUPON, an off-the-record discussion was had). 13 BY MRS. APRIL: 14 Q. A few more questions about what Mr. Rothstein told 15 you and the others who were present about the Epstein cases 16 and the cases that he anticipated would be settled. Okay? 17 A. Uh-huh (affirmative response). 18 Q. Did he tell you who was negotiating settlements on 19 behalf of the Rothstein firm's clients, who specifically? 20 A. Who was negotiating -- 21 Q• The settlements? In other words, did he tell you 22 it's me, Scott Rothstein, or it's -- 23 A. Oh, yeah. It was him. 24 Q. He said it was him? 25 A. Yeah. United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073746 Page 73 1 Q. Did he tell you what lawyers were actually working 2 on those cases? 3 A. On his side or -- 4 Q. On his side? 5 A. No. The story was that Scott, that's why he had a 6 separate office, handled all the confidential settlements. 7 All the other cases were handled by the firm. 8 Q. Did he tell you any of the names of the other 9 lawyers who even worked on these cases before they settled? 10 A. No. From what I -- That's what I'm trying to say, 11 he was the one that worked on these cases, Scott 12 personally. 13 Q. Did he ever mention the lawyers who had in his 14 firm -- who had originated the cases, you know, who brought 15 them into the firm? 16 A. No. 17 Q. Did he ever mention a lawyer named Brad Edwards? 18 A. No. 19 Q. Did you know that Brad Edwards was one of the 20 partners at that firm? 21 A. No. 22 Q. Did you ever hear that -- So you're telling me you 23 never heard the names of any lawyers who might have done 24 anything with these cases? 25 A. Correct. United Reporting, lnc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073747 Page 74 1 Q. Because Scott told you it was just Scott? 2 A. Right. 3 Q. Did you wonder how he got the cases? 4 A. Of course. 5 Q. And he told you that the first girl or the second 6 girl had led to many other potential settlements? 7 A. Uh-huh (affirmative response). 8 Q. But did he tell you how the very first one came to 9 him? 10 A. The story I remember was just, you know, Scott's 11 image and the fact that he was on several billboards, big in 12 the community, you know, he had gained a lot of exposure. I 13 think the mother had searched him out and wanted to speak 14 with him. I never knew it was an attorney, you know, or 15 somebody else in his firm that brought it to him. I didn't 16 get that detailed. 17 Q• And I think you said you didn't actually look at 18 any of the court papers to see who signed them for the firm? 19 A. Correct. 20 Q. But did Mr. Legamaro comment about that at all in 21 Scott's presence? 22 A. I don't remember. 23 Q. Do you know one of the girls was referred to as 24 III., does that -- is that something you remember? A. I don't remember that. United Reporting,Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073748 Page 75 1 Q• How about Jane Doe, did you ever hear them refer -- 2 or any girl referred to as Jane Doe? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. And did you understand that was to conceal her true 5 identity? A. Yes. 7 Q. Now, I had some -- Do you know, and you may not, 8 but do you know the total amount that was invested in the 9 Epstein group of settlements? 10 MR. KING: Objection to form. Foundation. 11 BY MRS. APRIL: 12 Q. It's okay. If you know? You mentioned your father 13 I believe was one of the investors? 14 I think it was 13 million, but 15 Q. You're not sure? 16 A. I'm not sure. 17 Q. Your lawyer has indicated that you are still 18 involved in certain litigation and, therefore, are reluctant 19 to testify about certain relationships and matters. So at 20 this time, I'm not sure if I can ask this question. She will 21 tell me or tell you if I can or not. 22 Are you engaged in any litigation with Mr. Ritchey 23 currently? 24 MRS. STREETER: You can answer that question. 25 A. Yes. United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073749 Page 76 1 Q. Well, in light of that, I am not going to pursue 2 certain questions that I might have otherwise, but I am going 3 to reserve the right to recall you at such time as if we deem 4 it necessary and if your willing to speak about it at a 5 future date. 6 MRS. APRIL: I don't have any other questions at 7 this time. 8 MR. KING: I don't have any questions. 9 MRS. STREETER: He will read. 10 (WHEREUPON, the deposition recessed at 11:40 a.m. 11 and the witness chose to Read and Sign). 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073750 Page 77 CERTIFICATE OF OATH STATE OF FLORIDA COUNTY OF BROWARD 4 5 I, Lee Lynott, Certified Merit Reporter, Notary 6 Public, State of Florida, certify that DEAN KRETSCHMAR 7 personally appeared before me on the 11th day of February, 8 2011 and was duly sworn. 9 Signed this 16th day of F ruary, 2011. 10 11 Lee ynott, RMR, RPR 12 Notary Public, State of Florida MY COMMISSION # DD996092 13 EXPIRES: June 29, 2014 Notary Public Underwriters 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073751 Page 78 REPORTER'S CERTIFICATE STATE OF FLORIDA )ss 3 COUNTY OF BROWARD 4 I, Lee Lynott, Certified Shorthand Reporter and Registered Merit Reporter in and for the County of Broward, 6 State of Florida, do hereby certify: 7 That prior to being examined DEAN KRETSCHMAR, the witness named in the foregoing deposition, was duly sworn by 9 the undersigned to testify to the truth, the whole truth, and 10 nothing but the truth. 11 That said deposition was taken before me at the time and 12 place set forth and was taken down by me in shorthand and 13 thereafter reduced to computerized transcription under my 14 direction and supervision, and I hereby certify the foregoing 15 is a full, true and correct transcript of my shorthand notes 16 so taken. 17 I further certify that I am neither counsel for nor 18 related to any party to said action nor in anywise interested 19 in the outcome thereof. 20 IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto subscribed my narr 21 this 16th day of February 2011. 22 Lee Lynott, RMR, RPR Notary Public, State of Florida MY COMMISSION # DD996092 24 EXPIRES: June 29, 2014 Notary Public Underwriters United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073752 Page READ NOTICE 2 3 4 February 16, 2011 5 6 C/O Dean Kretschmar CONRAD & SCHERER 7 ATT: MAXINE K. STREETER 633 South Federal Highway 8 Fort Lauderdale, Florida 33301 9 IN RE: Jeffrey Epstein vs. Scott Rothstein, et al., Dear Mr. Kretschmar: 12 Please be advised that your deposition given on February 11, 13 2011 is ready for your Reading and Signing. 14 Please contact our offices to make arrangements to Read your deposition transcript within 30 days from receipt. However, 15 if you have decided not to Read and Sign, please let us know as soon as possible. 16 If you should have any questions, please do not hesitate to 17 call. 18 Sincerely, 19 20 Lee Lyn MR Court Reporter 21 cc: Service List 22 23 24 25 United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073753 Page 80 1 ERRATA SHEET 2 I, the undersigned, DEAN KRETSCHMAR, do hereby certify that I have read the foregoing deposition and that, to the best of 3 my knowledge, said deposition is true and accurate (with the exception of the following corrections listed below): 4 PAGE/LINE CORRECTION REASON FOR CORRECTION 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 See attached sheet(s) for additional information: Yes # 17 STATE OF ) 18 ) SS.: COUNTY OF ) 19 Subscribed and sworn to before me, this day 20 of , 2011. 21 Dean Kretschmar Date 22 23 Notary Public My commission expires: 24 25 United Reporting, Inc. 954-525-2221 EFTA01073754